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The Greatest Game Every Played.
Sixties and Forty20 try to make sense of the insanity out of Round 26 after the Parramatta Eels held on to defeat the St George Illawarra Dragons 44-40. Although the Blue & Gold threatened to succumb to yet another late collape, the buffer of a 32-point lead with 10-minutes to play proved to be barely enough to secure their 6th win of the season.
The mood is understandly mixed after the manic final exchanges of the game and the boys vent their frustrations. There were also positives, believe it or not, including a rather outstanding record for Maika Sivo after he became the fast player to 100 tries in the NRL era.
The Entertainers….the Eels ‘hate’ the word easy….lol.
I said to the missus at 30-6, “Do you feel comfortable with this lead”…
I honestly felt uncomfortable about all of the missed conversions. Even at 44-12 I kept thinking that we should have been at least 50. But even in my wildest nightmare I didn’t think that last ten minutes was possible. Anyway, I’ve given my takes in the pod about why it happens. No need to re-write it here.
Completely agree sixties regarding your comment about unstructured football.
I believe it’s because of two aspects –
1. We have no speed.
Damn at present we would have to possess the slowest backline in the history of the NRL in our present form.
When a team starts playing unstructured football we just don’t have the speed to cover the half breaks and we panic.
2. We are not fit. Now to clarify, fitness is not just physical fitness. I believe that we could possess better physical fitness but we are miles behind in mind fitness in our presentation and application as you both explained.
A lot of teams hold ferocious army camps in their pre season where the individual is totally psychologically stripped down.
If ever there was a team that requires this sort of stripping down and rebuilding psychologically, it’s the Eels.
You mentioned that a win is a win and we should be thankful but you know, I reckon that I would have rather taken a loss where I know that the team played to their best ability , than that dross. It’s funny because for 70 minutes, they made themselves, thier club and their fans proud but their last 10 minutes wasn’t just bad , it was …. They just gave up ….and the fans just can’t cop that..
Spark our less speed and having less fitness is dimly undeniable. If it was one or two games I would disagree, but the same things happened almost every game all year even when we have more first graders in the team. Massively gassed compared to other teams. Also you watch other teams and you’ll see even their back up / reserve grade backs when they get a chance are better half the time than our actual regular starting backs. And say more speed. The eels have been ran into the ground with these shocking roster decisions like so many high paid forwards, yet all our backs besides gutho & Simmonson if we are being realistic here have been reserve graders playing NRL. Who in their right mind builds a NRL roster without having any speed in it in the back 5? Only Having 1 player (Bailey) who’s fast but not elite is a disgrace. When have we seen one team win a comp or dominate without extremely talented or fast backs in their team? You can’t be a competitive nrl team with backs who have a speed disadvantage and cannot defend. The teams roster is severely unbalanced, the stubborn people in charge and I don’t think it’s only our old coach but the actual HOF & co always low balled quality backs with shitty offers or short contracts too, while offering forwards the bank and some more. It’s been a joke. Anyway. On to next year. Hopefully with new ideas coming in, and a big kick up the ass / failing this year they won’t overlook the importance of high quality backs & speed ever again. You simply can’t succeed without it. Even the dolphins & Sharks BACK UP backs would run rings around our backs. It’s shameful when you watch other teams play and compare their fitness, athleticism & speed to ours. Even the dolphins look like a super star roster compared to us, and it’s a 2 year old NRL team who could originally sign mostly rejects other clubs didn’t want. The fast & young backs have been out there, our clubs roster & resources have been severely mismanaged. The proof is we have two of the best halves in the competition and a pool of former rep forwards and are currently fighting in a wooden spool bowl VS the tigers next week… 😅
I was having a coffee with a very good mate of mine this morning who is on the staff of a rival ( very successful) NRL team and he said that it’s thier overall thinking that the NRL will be basically touch football in the next 5 years.
Thier priority in thier recruitment is speed. Pure and simple.
They look at touch football, athletic sprinters etc whereas in the past it was purely focused on young football programs.
They figure that if they have the speed and altheletism, they can basically teach them the game.
Unfortunately, all the best teams are doing the same things.
We better get with the future.
Excuse the grammar.. on phone !
Spark, there was a time when there were four or five players with elite pace in the entire comp. Now every team has at least two fliers in there squad.
I’d be happy with one at the moment, I hope we can snag a winger with express pace for next season. Just that one flier would change the dynamics of our backline.
Our team has no trouble scoring points, even with the worlds slowest backline, we just don’t have the pace to defend against quicker opponents.
I’m all on board with Jason Ryles but for the life of me I can’t understand the retention of Jake Tago.
Much too slow to fit anywhere in our backline and this showed quite clearly when Saints shifted wide yesterday and he was running in quicksand.
The sort of players I’m talking about are blokes like Tyrone Munro at Souths. Rough around the edges but FAST.
The closest thing we have at the Eels is AMS but we just have to start recruiting these types of players.
Jo AMS, Simmonson, Iogni have all pretty decent pace & acceleration as you know. If Wilson signs then all of the sudden we have several pretty quick backs. I think next year football gods willing injury wise we have good backs stocks.
Super interesting mate spark RE touch football comments coming from your friend at another club. It’s clear the game has shifted and big hits and uncontrollable players who are too physical just give away penalties or get targeted by the refs.. what he is saying sounds like the trend we are seeing.
Also the thing about speed it’s absolutely true. Panthers mitigate this tho IMO with extremely fit players with seemingly unlimited gas tanks. They just look like the hardest working, most busiest players on the field in the NRL.
Maybe since we can compete to get only the fastest, we should aim to be the fittest and hardest working.
The bulldogs mantra apparently for this year is we aren’t the biggest or the fastest, but we will be the hardest working.
They have very strong fitness & defence focus which seems to be working. They have the speed out wide but that’s not what’s winning them the games. It’s helping but not the main thing.
Storms team is also you could argue even fitter & harder working them panthers this year, their whole team isn’t as big and power like compared to years past. Their big forwards who are a bit slower are always rumoured to be on the verge of being shopped off… the game style & speed has significantly shifted.
Look at how many ultra fit almost nobodies are killing it at panthers & storm? Younger bodies who can run all night in defence and seemingly are fit as a fiddle. I believe the bulldogs also have the best defence or close to it this year? Their forward pack is the opposite of a power pack. It’s a mobile squad with many utilitys.
Storm also has loads of utility players which is interesting! Hopefully Jason can resolve these strategic issues at the eels and move us into a more innovative club where we aren’t falling behind the 8 ball as the game seems to just keep getting faster.. yearly.
Spark, I must admit, I’d take a bad win over a good loss any day of the week. I do get your point though.
They telegraphed the mind fitness in the body language. With every try that the Dragons scored I kept saying to others around me, look at the scoreboard. The body language doesn’t make sense. They look like the losing team.
The last 10 minutes was an example of muscle memory, they retreated into their shell given recent history and it wasn’t pretty. If there was any doubt that Gutho organises the defence, then the game underlined his presence, much like the times he has been sin binned, defence structure seems to disappear.
Saints took advantage of a less than stellar left edge defence, that’s been a negative since Dylbro was forced to the right.
The skeleton of a very decent side is there, needs careful additions to start an upward path.
Boy, we were one set away from being in the record books for wrong reasons again. I would have been unbearable today, thankfully for my family’s sake I won’t be slamming doors and kicking dogs. Forty nailed it last week, no lead is big enough, never a truer word said.
In the course of a successful season, that score would be embarrassing but the embarrassment is on the Dragons. They had everything to play for, our boys were just having fun ruining their season. At least we won’t have the media banging on about Lomax leaving a top 8 team.
What’s up with Sivo? Scoring tries, saving tries, making line breaks and running hard on kick returns in the same game.
The game is flush with fancy wingers who want to fly over defenders, Sivo breaks down the front door, he must be the most dangerous winger 20 metres out when he’s in the mood.
I hope he can bring his current form into 2025. Lomax and Sivo on the right edge could be lethal.
Sivo has obviously realised that his days of just coasting by is coming to an end.
He could be elite player but damn he has some rubbish in his game!
His dropped ball when he collected the up and under and ran down the sideline was pivotal but he was not only carrying the ball in one arm he was carrying it in one hand!! – he lost it cold and basically started the avalanche of Saints points.
Small moments but because we were at the 70th minute and gassed we couldn’t hold out his mistake.
How is Sivo not making 200 to 300m per game? It just doesn’t make sense 110kg winger who is much faster than he let’s on. If he was given the ball in space something we could do with early shifts. He could be huge from dummy half or 3rd tackle. Sivo only gets the ball first tackle off their kick or last tackle in red zone. If we don’t get to red zone he doesn’t get the ball again. It’s just a waste. He needs to get more involved. He only has about 10 runs when he needs about 20 runs.
Lomax 6 from 7
Asi 4 from 9
Next week will be 58 to 54. Must practice goal kicking and take it seriously.
Pete I don’t know if it’s true but I saw somewhere apparently sivo is ultra fast for his sick and one of the fastest at the eels? Maybe with his build and age it holds him back from those big metres and work rate possibly
For his size* sorry
Yes Muz, I did see that Sivo 36km/h in the international game I think.
Time and space he needs.
Sivo will only run as fast as he wants never as fast as he can.
You mentioned Sivo’s age and at times I wonder if his recorded age is actually correct – Fijians do not always record their birt dates ?
That’s hilarious Pete here we are thinking we lack speed and sivo is probably the fastest big player in the nrl 😂
Down through the ages Parra has lost games because of goal kicking. In sixty six years I can only recall a handful of decent kickers. Cronin Burt and Moses with Burt being the most consistent. To score 44 points against a team in the top eight is significant, to score 34 points against a team in the top four tells us our attack had come together. Was it Spark who said it Is a mental thing. It must be – they mentally clock off. Once that happens you cannot get back into the game. I would keep Sivo 100 tries in 113 games – is phenomenal. This is the coaches fault in not insisting he involve himself more. He Sivo had the same attitude as To’o then we have our own Jonah Lomu. Ryles should keep him and instill into him a killer attitude.
We get our fitness right and minimize our injuries to our key players Parra will be a top four next year. And, of course, our fitness.
Two things for 2025 fitness and a better mental outlook with a killer instinct. Yes I know we need speed and everyone else has it – but a truly organized defense ia better. Sivo has been clocked faster than 34kph. We just need to get more out of him.
By the way we won yesterday so I am happy. We dominated Penrith and lost. Sorry but I will accept any win at the moment. We beat the Tigers next week and the Roosters kill Souths we move 15th spot.
Some great attack and some putrid defence. That’s the parra identity. We can’t defend and we rely on having possession as our main form of defence. Has been like that for years.
Good to see sivo rip in but I don’t get too moved by performances like this by sivo. It’s too late and he’s too old + on big coin. He should be moved on regardless. Ditto for lane. Sure he has played a little better recently but it’s still not good enough. We can’t get fooled by the fact he has played better relative to the terrible depths of performance he sunk to earlier in year. These players can’t be there for next year. They aren’t part of any parra team to take forward into new style of football.
Moretti played great which I enjoyed. Dyl was superb at half and asi is so far below average. I’m glad we are seeking a proper back up half.
Hopefully soon we learn that sivo, rcg, lane and wiremu are all being let go early (in addition to Harper, makatoa etc who are off contract)
Ron, I hope Ryles is an astute judge and can see Lane needs to be moved on. You don’t win big games with minimal effort players like that in your side.Luca will prosper with as much top grade footy as you can give him. He wants to be involved. Sivo I like. You don’t create records like he has without having ability.Put him in a better backline and a team with a tougher defensive and mental attitude and then judge him. Let’s just hope that Ryles is a hard head and picks players on the effort they put in.
Can more of us give props to Luca? Just like many forwards BA has helped to develop he runs with intensity and genuinely makes a visible impact when he is on the field.
Luca is young and on the up so to speak. But he makes an impact and chases the work to get involved while he on the field. Luca might end being another Nathan brown type of player for us if he keeps on working hard. People who say they are impressed by him.. watch the work rate & impact he brings when he is on.
I feel like Luca & Charlie Guymer could play significant roles in our Eels NRL campaign next year and may shock many of us I feel like.
We definitely need guymer and Luca to play a pivotal role next year as they give us more line speed, leg speed and mobility (Pryke should also be fast tracked to nrl in the next 2 years or so).
We need a back up half (eg Hawkins)
We need Blake Wilson or stonestreet or some other quick winger
And finally we need a solid defensive backrower to improve our edge defence. Lane has to go and kelma is putrid defensively and in effort on effort sequences.
Ron yeah I feel like Luca & Guymer look like very solid bench impact players unlike many forwards we run off and on in the 17 you can see the visible impact they make when they come on the field.
The youth + leg speed is truly needed in our rotation. I know it’s a big ask but if those young men can stay healthy for 25’ and we snag say Wilson or stone street plus have Iongi at the back, with Lomax & simmonson. All the sudden that’s a strong back line and a team who can probably compete for the top 8. Which is a significant improvement from this season.
The other thing is lane as you mentioned. I believe a stat indicated he is near top of the list of players whose missed tackles or errors have led to tries. You simply can’t win enough games if you have 1 or 2 players who leak easy tries or make stupid errors which lead to tries every game.
Brad probably already got the best out of say Lane, sivo, RCG, paulo. They were good players before but either their time had passed or their body styles don’t suit the speed & work rate of the modern game in terms of defending. Hopefully coach Ryles can respectfully move on from them and get those young forwards we’ve got to keep improving and slowly fill those roles. Guymer & Luca could turn out to be very important players for us, that youth & leg speed is something that can instantly make an impact. Guys like Makatoa can no longer provide us with that type of impact from the bench. There’s a trend here that all of our older players are starting to struggle with the pace of the game: the youth injection is much needed next year if we are to turn our fortunes around.
Interesting Muz. The maths escape me, but when Papali’i,Niukore, Mahoney, Stone and Kaufusi left the average age of our regular forwards went skyward.
Yeah we definitely miss those players severely Bdon we haven’t looked close since. Hopefully better times ahead 🤞 some of our younger forwards like Luca & Guymer look good for our rotation to add in the youthful legs for 25’
Yes agree Luca and Gymer will be good.
Tks guys, yes that was near unbelievable, and sixties I too was thinking how can we lose this with 4 seconds on the clock, such was my confidence. With Gutho off, who was barking orders?
The Gods even ordained that a trusted defender Dylan Brown hit a bloke hard but bounce off like a tennis ball for another 6 points.Our scramble was non existent ( it takes someone to make the effort) and we lacked speed to recover. We fell for the same one, two punches. We just clocked off, too many people thinking ‘we ve got this’. And losing the ball in the middle of a Dragons onslaught was so poor.
I’m wondering which players will genuinely improve under new coaching and better balanced roster, efforts like this one could suggest there’s a few guys hiding in the shadows of widespread mediocrity, and the ultimate irony is that one bloke who is definitely not hiding looks like going any tick of the clock.
Good podcast here and accurately done.
Sixties I won’t be guessing crowds mate!! You were abt spot on here.
I was happy with our game for the majority and really liked how we used the ball and also first half we seemed to make minimal errors? I was at game and can’t recall many.
Moretti was good and so was RCG; I also thought there were some good things from most of the backs…Asi did ok for me and Brown was good as needs to be.
We fell apart it seems with ad lib footy!! Funny that. Body language was crap…needed someone to stand up and tell them to aim up for the first few sets etc very poor ending.
That game was unbelievble. How can a team score nine tries and come within a whisker, all erupting in the last 10 minutes?
Moretti was unbelievable. I got very excited by his energy and intent. Wow! Ofahengaue
and RCG were just fantastic. Absolute machines. I loved how they destroyed the Dragons up the guts.
Maika Sivo was Thor’s hammer. Amazing. Which makes his other performances this year hard to take, hard to fathom.
But those last 10 minutes. Like a lot of you, I also said to myself (also to my young son) that a massive Eels collapse was coming. We all knew it. It was just a pattern we all saw this year.
There has to be something between the ears that’s really stopping this team from rising out of this horrible rut. It’s groundhog day. Can Jason Ryles knock the Eels out of this awful pattern of destruction?
I feel the winds of change coming. I can feel it 100%. I can’t wait for the 2025 season
This is from an interview in 2020
Parramatta winger Maika Sivo is a strong, strong human.
If you have any doubts about that, just ask Roosters fullback James Tedesco. They’re still digging him out of the Bankwest Stadium turf after being steamrolled by Sivo last week.
The hulking Fijian flyer made headlines in pre-season when reports claimed he had maxed out at squatting 285 kilograms in the Eels gym… only because they couldn’t fit anymore plates on the bar.
And now his coach Brad Arthur has corroborated those stories, revealing just how frightening Sivo is in the club gym.
Arthur told NRL 360 the club’s conditioning and coaching staff have actually limited Sivo’s weights sessions in case he gets too big.
We’ve had to really pull back on his weighs because he’s so big and strong, and he doesn’t carry any body fat,” Arthur said.
“He’s still running around at 110 (kilograms) or 111 each week at training as a winger, so that’s very imposing, very strong in the gym.
“When the boys were doing full weighs sessions in the pre-season he was doing two or three, and a lot of extra conditioning.
“It’s a credit to him and Steve Murphy who’s done a lot of work with Maika, and I think his best football is still further down the track for him.”
Arthur has two of the most athletic wingers in the game on his roster, with Blake Ferguson occupying the other flank.
He was asked on NRL 360 whether Sivo or Ferguson was easier to coach.
“That’s an easy one… it’s Maika,” he laughed.
“Fergo needs a lot of energy. But he brings a lot.”
Quoted from Fox Sports 2020.
Haha That’s a crazy article the bit about teddy being dug up out of bank west. That was horrific that ko.
Mate sivo is massive, you can see it at the live games when you sit close to the sidelines he’s a big block of Fijian muscle. But runs like a cat some weeks (for his size & athletic anyhow).. and he can run at 35KM/H? He can probably squat more than all of our forwards. Sad to see sivo go but he had some good years, wish him all the best In future. He was a good player for us for a long time. Got his century of tries didn’t he which is a great milestone at parra.
There’s a big difference between gps fast and footy fast. Sick might be former but latter is way more important and he certainly doesn’t have that. He’s too lazy and slow in acceleration. Go back and watch is mediocre effort on sailor try last week – gave up so early in chase back and left gutho out to dry. Sooner we get rid of him the better. He’s only gonna get older, slower and lazier
It says Sivo is 30 turning 31 in October if that is accurate.
He’s the best ever scorer 10m out. 90% of his tries would be 10-20m.
He’s had different training due to his physique. That’s probably given him the wrong message that he doesn’t need to try as hard as the others. Steve Murphy was given a lot of credit for working with Maika. Clearly it’s been wrong messaging and poor coaching. Remember his tackle technique? How many suspensions? Too many again coaching.
BA admitted Sivo was easier to coach (out of Fergo and Sivo). But he couldn’t get him doing what was required or getting more involved.
We had the best wingers at one stage Fergo dropped off a cliff under our systems. Sivo has been good at close range but we needed more.
Yeah it’s definitely an interesting one regarding sivo he is also Fijian and very relaxed he probably isn’t a guy who likes to overly push himself especially as gets older. But definitely there’s a clear track record of all our outside backs defending poorly regardless for years it seems like
Agree, Even Gutho on the wing was horrendous. Ferguson was best winger in the comp at Roosters and dropped off a cliff in our system.
Looking ahead, the first 70 minutes showed that Ryles has something to work with in 2025. And credit to TB who was got a lot out a makeshift team. It will serve him well when he becomes interim coach of the Broncos midway through 2025.
Regarding the chaotic final 10 minutes, granted every Hail Mary pass and trick shot stuck for the Dragons the observation about the Eels’ body language reflects the difficult 2024 season as much as lack of faith in the defensive systems. Sam Moa you have some work to do from the 1st of November.
Bring on the Spoon Bowl. A game that promises to be just as wild.
I agree mate. Ryles definitely has something to work with, the fact we have a reserve grader littered starting team weekly and pile on points against any team in the top 8 is remarkable un itself… because we are bottom of the table. If we can have less injuries and more luck I believe we are a top 8 side easily next year. But if we lost say gutho & moses for large portions of the season? I still think we would collapse. We are Still too reliant on those two. Fingers crossed we get Hawkins from south’s who’s a real #7, and Wilson who’s a legit speedster back, Plus Iongi who’s a legit specialist fullback. If we can have all of these new & back up players healthy (and those extras mentioned signed)… then I believe the Eels are a top 8 side in 2025. 🙏
Muz, yes if the footy gods bless us with a relative injury free 2025 a return to the 8 is a good bet. Iongi and Lomax will add a lot to the back line. Though Gutho is showing that even with no legs he still is a remarkable player.
I was thinking about Hawkins today and I suspect he sees a better opportunity to learn under Mitch than anyone at Souths.
Watching that game at the ground was what I imagine an out of body experience is like.
Just a crazy last10 minutes. As soon as saints scored that first of the run of tries I could hear people echoing my thoughts of “oh no, here we go again”. There is plenty of work to be done by the new coaching staff, probably most of it between the ears. That aside I’ll take the win and I was there for the final siren unlike plenty of saints fans who had left before the near miracle comeback. To come so close cuts deep.