Parramatta Eels 6
Penrith Panthers 12
The Good: |
We looked really, really good in the trial at Maitland.
Fine. The effort today was really, really good, we got plenty of penalties (12 to the Panthers’ 11) and for the first time this season we had the majority of possession. If anyone tells you “the players don’t care” or “they’re not even trying” point them to the game tape. If they persist, try pull off their mask like a Scooby Doo episode, exposing their true nature. I’ll be honest with you, I’m pretty flat after today’s result so I’m going to let Twitter do a lot of the talking tonight. |
The Bad: |
Well, we lost again and are now the only team in the NRL without a win. We also had 15 errors leading and only completed at 68%. Yuck.
Still, this wasn’t our biggest issue, as we defended (or at least scrambled) pretty well. Even with all the above, we still could have easily won the game today. The reason we didn’t? We were absolutely inept in attack.
We spent more time in the Panthers’ half, had more ball, made more metres, won more scrums, forced more line drop outs and spent nearly a quarter of the game in the Panthers’ 20.
Yet we still only managed one weird grubber kick, fumble try in 80 minutes after scoring three tries in the final 15 minutes of last week. It’s easy for me to say, but I think we just need to relax a little and with all that possession we probably should have more than 5 offloads. |
X-Factor: |
This is now the Eels’ worst start to the season since 1991. In other news, you know what’d make you an X-Factor? Proudly wearing the merchandise of the only winless team in the NRL. That is edgy. The fact that you’re even thinking about it makes me want to date you, and I’m married with 3 kids. Click here. Well, again this week you can get yourself a Mens 2018 Eels Heritage Jersey; which is normally $170, for only $153 with free shipping if you use the code ‘TCT’ at It’s win, win – buy yourself a cracking jersey and support the work of The Cumberland Throw. The Eels are yet to win, however. |
The MVP:
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Nathan Brown’s 149 metres is mental, and so far ahead of anyone else in our forward pack it’s a little depressing. Cyborg also had a team leading 4 tackle breaks, 41 tackles and no misses.
He also destroyed RCG’s moustache and followed it up with this.
Shut it down, Nathan Brown. |
The Starters
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1- Will SmithFullback, Parramatta Eels Will Smith is excellent in one in every three performances, and average in the other two. Not unlike his actor namesake. |
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2- George JenningsRight Wing, Parramatta Eels Not as terrific as he was last week. Sure Gennings scored our lone try, but he wasn’t particularly effective otherwise; 10 runs for 59 metres, and 2 errors. At least he didn’t miss a tackle, I guess. |
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3- Michael JenningsRight Centre, Parramatta Eels I loved his 5 tackle breaks, but the two errors hurt me, Michael. They cut me real deep. |
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4- Kirisome Auva’aLeft Centre, Parramatta Eels Yeah, I guess. |
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5- Josh HoffmanLeft Wing, Parramatta Eels Hoff did good things today, he has been pretty good for us this year. But that dropped ball with the line wide open? That killed us, man. It shouldn’t matter, we need to be better than desperately needing to convert every opportunity. But we were 0-4, and we needed that try today.
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6- Corey NormanFive-Eighth, Parramatta Eels I thought both our halves tried hard today. Still, our attack didn’t click and that needs to be laid not only at the feet of each of them, but also our attacking structures overall. Blind Freddy Fittler could have seen how clunky, mistimed and single phase our attack was today. Yes everyone tried hard today, but the overall execution is still not there. Back to Corey, despite what I’ve written about the team’s overall attack above, I thought today was his best game since Round 1. Also, that was one sweet 40/20 my man. |
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7- Mitchell MosesHalfback, Parramatta Eels Sure he missed 4 tackles (for the record everyone’s favourite half James Maloney missed 10), but you can tell how much he hates losing. Also, the Prince of Egypt did drop a ball in the Panthers’ red zone, one of many momentum killers. It seems harsh to blame either of our halves today for our inept attack, as they both took the line on plenty. If nothing else, Mitchell played with plenty of effort today, but like a number of our other players, is probably guilty of trying too hard in attack. |
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8- Daniel AlvaroProp, Parramatta Eels Polar’s 12 runs for 98 metres was ok and although it’s not going to blow your socks off, his 38 tackle count (with only 1 miss) is pretty impressive. Make no mistake, Danny is a no frills, tradesman-esque player; and although he’s not a Jason Taumalolo or Andrew Fifita (thank the Lord), he plays his role for the Eels week in, week out. Danny Boy is a reliable and valuable contributor to the Eels. |
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9- Kaysa PritchardHooker, Parramatta Eels I’ve kinda lost belief in our hooker rotation, and 6 missed tackles from Kaysa did my faith no favours. I’d love for BA to open up some sort of alternate universe where Reed Mahoney was both eligible and ready for first grade, but I don’t know if that’s the universe we currently live in. |
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10- Tim Mannah (c)Prop, Parramatta Eels There’s something off with our starting prop rotation, and in my unprofessional opinion Mannah and Alvaro are probably guilty of being too similar stylistically. Mannah’s numbers are normally pretty defendable against his army of unrelenting haters, but today’s 5 runs for 63 metres, and a really dumb sin binning makes it a pretty difficult task this week. |
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11- Manu Ma’uBack Row, Parramatta Eels It was good to see a bit of fire in Manu’s belly again today, running for 113 metres (from his 13 hit ups). The nature of where we had the ball (in the Penrith 20 for over 18 and a half minutes) means running numbers for all players are a little down, but I thought Monster Mash’s 2 tackle breaks and 28 tackles rounded out a nice game. |
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17- Tony WilliamsBack Row, Parramatta Eels Compared to last week’s MVP effort from T-Rex, today was a markedly quieter game from the coelurosaurian theropod. His 8 runs for 67 metres didn’t really lead to much, although the 4 tackle breaks are always welcome. With that said, I think he’s already justified the 1 year deal handed to him in 2 games he’s played. |
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13- Nathan BrownLock, Parramatta Eels I heard he also hates Wayne Bennett. |
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Interchange
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12- Tepai MoreoaInterchange, Parramatta Eels Poor bloke has had more knocks than a cricket bat. Tough day at the office for Tep, with only 6 runs for 47 metres and 13 tackles … I like it better when he starts, personally. |
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14- Beau ScottInterchange, Parramatta Eels Beau sees your true colours, and that’s why he I thought Beau was energetic and chased well on our kicks. His game today was pretty good. Still, I just think we need more in one of our bench spots than a bloke absolutely busting his gut. We simply cannot afford to absorb getting only 5 runs for 47 metres when other teams get that lift AND an effective running game. Something has gotta give with our bench, as the only effective punch we’re getting is from the resident crazy bloke. Speaking of which … |
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15- Kenny EdwardsInterchange, Parramatta Eels I thought he was pretty excellent today, and today’s game only cemented my belief that his best role is off the bench. Kedwards had a terrific 7 runs for 85 metres, a terrific 7 tackle breaks and 19 tackles. For the uninitiated, that’s good Kenny, baby. |
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16- Peni TerepoInterchange, Parramatta Eels I have defended the Butcher for about two years longer than everyone else. But, two dropped balls and an intercepted pass in our most important game of the year? Get in the sea, Peni. I have loved you, but you continue to scorn me. I knight thee the Dave Taylor of the Parramatta Eels. |
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This is basically my mood right now.
It’s turning into one of those “I remember where I was standing when …” moments.
Nothing left to do but move onto next week. See you then, sports fans.
Go you Eels,
Mitch.
After losing an unprecedented first 5 games of the season, I feel really sorry for our Post Game Grades sponsor. We literally haven’t won a game since he started sponsoring us, so please, buy something from Sportfirst because I’m considering taking up drinking.
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Photos courtesy of the Parramatta Eels. Stats courtesy of Champion Data.
Stop reading this and go buy something from SportFirst – Nambucca.
Peni was running to the line and delivering passes. Almost like a half SHOULD be doing.
Yes.. His hands do let him down but he was the only player passing at the line.
I agree, his passing basically led us to that Jennings grubber that Maloney knocked dead (IIRC). Still, similarly to Hoff, I couldn’t overlook the big moments in his game, which today were unfortunately negative.
I can forgive Peni for the intercept, we were never going to crash through the line with one out charges. Its obvious to me we need to move the ball more…..much much more. Lets let our forwards take a few less “post contact metres” and position ourselves for an off load. If we are going to drop the ball in a one out charge, I’d rather lose it from an attempted offload.
Yeah I touched on that above, I didn’t watch all of it but I think I remember Beau saying something in the presser about the players being too hesitant to push the pass with so much on the line.
Anyways, in short I agree. Second phase play would help a lot.
As others have noted.. I reckon that other than the obvious size difference in the forwards – our biggest problem is a decent hooker.
I’m a great Mahoney fan and both the Tigers and Sharks have younger hookers so age shouldn’t be an issue.
Maybe we have to throw Farah a lifeline?
I’d love Cash Mahoney to somehow get a run.
0-5 start to the season is unbelievable bad!
We have actually score the same amount of tries as our opposition in 3 of those games with only penalties goals being the difference. Just got to somehow find a way to win.
I tweeted this earlier and was hounded for sugar coating a tough loss. So even though I obviously agree with what you’ve said, Twitter reminded me that regardless of such a stat, we’re still 0-5.
Our try differential in 4 out 5 games is -1. It’s crazy.
Anyways – well said.
Our points differential is -90 though. So whilst we can take something out of the try-differential stat (minus the Manly rout) we have an amazingly poor points differential and zero competition points – both things which actually make or break a season.
Don’t get me wrong, I’d love to see some stats that give me hope, but at this early stage in the season I’m more interested in stats that give us some insight into root cause. Give us a few more losses and I’ll break out the rose coloured glasses because our season will be all but gone so my mind will move to the “enjoy what you can” mentality. But right now all I can focus on is “How can we salvage this season?” because I’ve far from given up hope yet.
I’m sure Brad and his team are pouring over the numbers to try to figure out how to stop the issues as well, so we’ll see what the weeks ahead have to show. Here’s hoping we can start turning these smaller losses into small (or big) wins!
Well said Captain. We’re still in the fight.
I am pleased with improved performance today, not so with the loss, but at least its looking better into the rest of the year if the improvement continues.
While this will not come as a surprise here, I thought Kaysa worked his gut out, he seemed to be in everything and was still going at the end. I doubt very much that King would have gone as strong over the same time. I also agree that somehow Mahony somehow needs to come in to the side.
There needs to be a very big improvement in our go forward, while Brown did a wonderful hit on Campbell-Gillard, he returned the compliment not long after though, would love to see him in an eels jersey.
We bombed at least 3 or 4 tries, and the only Penrith try came as the result of Mannah’s sin binning. We also need to start taking shots at goal from penalties, as we have lost too many games over the years as a result of not taking those shots, whereas how many other teams have won matches by taking them?
Totally agree with taking the shot at goal. If for no other reason than taking the pressure off the halves. They no like everybody else that if they fail to score a try after knocking back an easy shot for two points it is a massive fail.
I had a debate with the guy next to me at the game. He was arguing go for the try me for the goal. If we had taken the two shots we would have drawn level and put a lot of pressure on a tiring Panthers
Thanks John, your last sentence about taking the pressure off Penrith is very true, they sat comfortably with 2 points, likely knowing that they take each shot at goal and win that way, all teams know we don’t take shots at goal from penalties. If the shot misses we still get the ball back, if it was kicked same points as Penrith & they have to go and kick off, they might get a bit of a rest in the process, but so does the eels.
It tells the other side we can match you, and give as many penalties as you like and we can penalise you as a consequence with the points. Not just tries win matches, and a penalty goal can cover for a missed conversion.
I remember Keith Campbell going for a penalty goal from own side of half way, a bit of laughter as people thought he would never kick it. It went through with space to spare and won the game as a result.
I seen Kevin Longbottom kick a couple in the 1965 GF for Souths
Teams always took the shot at goal but some time in the nineties it changed when teams believed it better to keep the pressure on and not take the 2 points
Since then it has become normal. The Broncos under Bennett have gone back to taking the 2 for some time now
I’d love to see us taking shots at goal down by 4. Perfect opportunity to put pressure on the opposition, even if we can’t take the lead.
The upside of the tap and go is two fold, however. The sin bin pressure on Merrin/Mannah is one slight upside, but the other more tangible benefit is tiring out the opposition by asking them to make another 5-6 tackles. Hindsight is 20/20 of course.
Mitch, totally correct and its really a big decision. Our failure to capitalize on Merrins binning to me is mind blowing especially 10 odd minutes later when Mannah goes off as well, with a converted try, taking them to 8. Replay those minutes with us taking the goal could well have been different, but that’s hypothetical hindsight.
At least when you take the goal and its kicked, it also adds to the for and against tally as the season progresses, which could very well make the difference at the end of the normal season as to where the team sits on the table, and even in the 8 or not.
I think the other aspect of taking the two points on offer is it makes them less likely to give away penalties in their own Red Zone. Defensive penalties in the Red Zone have been a ploy for some time now.
John, agree totally and as said elsewhere I have been saying this for some years now, along with the aspect of 2 points over the black dot may also mean 2 on the table as well, rather than none with a loss.
0-5 not many positives we offer nothing. I’m a Peni fan but not his best game but he ran hard all game still better than Evans.
I thought there were positives today, but as you noted they’re overridden by the fact that we’re 0-5. At least we have something to build on and it wasn’t another middle 50 vs the Tigers (or even worse, 80 vs Manly).
Good read Mitch. But for the life of me can someone tell me how we have gone from smashing Newcastle in the trial to playing like a local A-Grade side ?
Like everyone I’m at a loss … Can you drive back to maitland n see if you can find there form n bring it back to them.
From the form we are showing the only person who should get his pay is T-Rex.
Look … I love my team n to see them play like this breaks my heart. We’re is the 2017 team the team that played with pride passion.
On the ratings I think your a hit hard on karisome avau’a. He ran hard his form is not as bad as it looks. Look at the end of the day we all know his a centre not a winger.
IMO I would be happy to see Austin swap for Norman … Norman n Hayne together = trouble for our side they clown around to much there selfish players there not team players.
I .. like you Mitch would like if brad starts tepai moeroa in the 2nd row n bring Kenny back to the bench. Moeroa is solid as a starting 2nd rower. He gives us no punch coming off the bench.
My side for next week baring injuries n poor form.
1. Hoffman
2. French
3. M, Jennings
4. Avau’a
5. G, Jennings
6. Smith
7. Moses
8. Mannah
9. Pritchard. ( His speed out of DH get him over the line) Only just over king.
10. Alvaro
11. Manu
12. Moeroa
13. Brown. If injured then Norman. His got the skills get him the chance to attack on both side of the field.
Bench 14. Scott.
15. T-Rex.
16. Peni
17. Kenny .
Reserves.
18 gower
19. King .
#Eels4life#
Sorry swap Scott for vave we need size from the bench to combate JP & SB up front.
Vave us on the outer don’t expect him back
You know something Offside?
Yeah ive got a source or two. his dedication is consistently called into question.
Notice hes been fit to play but not named in the 21 at all.
Have you actually watched porky vave.
I can’t imagine he or Matagi finding their way back to first grade unless injuries strike.
Rev.
My concern now is not the defence, but its the floundering attack.
You ask about the difference between the team we have and its performance now to the Maitland game? I would add in the first 30minutes of the first match against Penrith, since then and up until yesterday the defence and attack must have been left at Penrith park and buried at half time.
The team as a whole needs to sit down and watch the Maitland game and have it pointed out to them how they won, then the first 30 of the Penrith game, but then show how they lost it. If they want further embarrassment they need go no further than the manly debacle.
The 6&7 are no longer working together, their sideways plays almost look as if they want to go into the sheds rather than stay on the paddock, both are too one dimensional as against their abilities to go forward in attack as per 2017 and Maitland.
No way is the coach to blame for what happens on the field but he has to finally look at the squad he has and make changes, ones that will be effective, and to me that includes some young legs with enthusiastic bodies.
Don’t blame Pritchard, as on his performance yesterday he was still going despite exhaustion late in the match, compared to King who was on his haunches half way through the 2nd half against Penrith, and no better with Manly. I would love to see Mahoney given a shot if it was possible.
Two vital comparisons from the game in regard to experience and brain useage can be found when both teams had a man in the bin. Penrith scored a try owing to the brains and skill of Maloney, age has not wearied him. Eels could not do the same when Penrith were down, owing to youth (moses) and not using the skills he has, other words not using his football brain.
With all due respect to Pritchard, despite his terrific efforts and tenacity, his service suffers the longer a game goes on. I think we are suddenly very weak in the hooking area, and I now have this as a focal point going forward, as well as middle forwards and another good winger.
I agree with you Brother Mitch on kp’s service out of DH.
Brother hussey take a walk back to “2001” not the GF we won’t go that far.
I recall Brian smith using 2 Dummy halfs. Piggy n PJ. It worked then so why can’t it work know ?
The bench in 2001 was 2 props 1DH n 1 back row utility. Aka D, wagon.
Kp’s speed along with kings skills like kicking out of DH.
Surley it still has to work carrying a 2nd hooker.
#Eels4life#
Fair call Rev. I have wondered at times why BA has not tried to use both King and KP, he used Smith on the bench as a utility with both Kaysa and King last year, more so IIRC with King after Kaysa was playing big minutes and worked his way up to the 80 minutes to which he was at before the tackle that knocked him out with the injury.
Working out who would play with which forwards would be interesting, one of them play at the start with one set of the forwards the other at the interchange time, could very well work. Thing is though it would still stymie the coaches desire for an 80minute hooker and all forward bench.
Brother hussey for the live of me I don’t know why he wants a 4 forward bench.
Like why ….if we have a 80 minute 2nd rower why would you bring him of for another one …yes he might be fresh but it’s a waste of a interchange.
It’s time BA goes back with 2 props 1DH & 1 utility. It worked last year can’t see why it won’t this year.
On another thing these block plays that is something that is not working …. It needs to stop
You don’t think Browny deserves his pay packet Rev?
Forgot him brother Mitch ….
All good mate. He’s central to our future success; he and Gutho, Tepai, Alvaro, Bevan and Moses IMO.
LOL. Norman at lock.
Ksysas buggest problem is his service from dummy half is to slow
Agreed. And often a little inaccurate.
So brother mattL were do you play him if his not combining well with Moses ?
5/8th brother. They’ll click once they get some go forward and straight runners coming off then.
Why not mattL we have had many 5/8’s that have turned into good lock forwards.
Just to name a few ok.
Jason smith, jim dymock, Daniel wagon, so I can’t see why Norman can’t make that switch.
He doesn’t have the build of any of those ex five eighths though. None of those locks you mentioned also had the build to play fullback. Just doesn’t make a great deal of sense to have Corey at 13, Rev.
Different game these days. Browny is considered small.
Before the game I said all I wanted was discipline. BA this club needs you to be disciplined. Watching today was like watching the bulldogs in 2017. Des wanted his team to play a style that did not compliment his players and it did not work. Our forwards can not or won’t play the game we need. I don’t want to here they can or they do at training. Not once this year have our forwards worked. Apart from Taka and Evans we have no injuries.Three of our best backs are out, that creates the clunkiness, our forwards have no excuse.
BA save this club and that means save yourself, we loose you – we loose Gutho, French and Moses, they will not stay or re-sign if BA is sacked. This club and us supporters can not survive another coach sacking and 5 year rebuild. I will walk, it will kill me but I will.
If BA does not change his forwards then we will not beat Raiders, Manly, Tigers or Sharks ( our next 4 games) If we loose the next four games and BA makes no changes, if he continues to pick forwards who actually don’t go forward or some who only run the ball in the attacking red zone, he will get sacked. You can’t keep dishing up rubbish, be given chance after chance and not be called on it.
We called for a better kicking game. We got it. We called for Norman and Moses to take the line on. They did and what happened not one bloody lazy forward, apart from Brown and Kenny, went with them, Will Smith back up- no let’s stay out next to our centres to cramp them for room, Kaysa too exhausted (surprised not) to back up and so guess what Norman and Moses easy targets and they got smashed. The big Panther forwards smashed them.
Yep that’s a plan let’s make our halves go to the line, because the last 4 weeks have all been on them, run to a defensive line that is set as most of our forwards run like bloody ballet dancers. Lets make Norman and Moses do the work of our so called forwards and then set up the kicking game and shifts wide. In fact why do we name forwards at all, because apart from Kenny and Brown our forwards today let down our club, fans and BA.
Blame Norman and Moses all you want. People who do, are blind. But apart from Kenny and Brown our forwards are playing terrible. Keep either Mannah or Alvaro ( my choice by a mile) next week but not both. Terepo could not catch a cold BUT at least he ran the ball into their pack. Many of our other forwards camped out in the centres and run at the Panther backs. We sit behind the goal post. Try it next home game and you will see what we do. Brown, Kenny and Alvaro the only ones who take the had runs. The others hide out wide.Bring in a young energetic second rower who might actually have a go and run some sort of line as a decoy on our shifts or at least support, show something. Give Gower and Vave a chance, can they really go any worse. They might miss tackles and misread plays but at least they won’t hide when the going gets tough.
Our forwards today should be ashamed of themselves they left Brown, Alvaro and Kenny to take on the entire Panthers forward pack by themselves. Every other forward ran soft. God help us if Brown is seriously injured. Imagine our pack without Brown. In fact it might be good to see Brown not play next week( I hope he is fine) there will no where to hide and our forwards and dare I say co- captains will have no one to hide behind.
Fans, our backs, our halves, our injured players and sponsors got let down today. Unless we fix our forwards Norman and Moses can not fix the backs. Hoffman dropped a sitter but at least he was in position to catch it. Most of our forwards refused to take the tough hits ups on our try line. They ran plenty when on attack, but offered still nothing just a one man hit up, but hid when we needed them to get us out of our defensive end. Merrin, Gillard, Tamou,Yeo, Fisher Harris didn’t hide- no Panther forward hid.
The person who got let down the most is BA. Our forwards let him down. BA said in an interview on Fox before the season started if you don’t like how our forwards play blame me, they play the way I tell them to. I can’t imagine BA told them to run like ballet dancers (take Brown and Kenny out of that)
So here is the question BA needs to answer. A loyal, dedicated resilient fan does not like the way our forwards play so BA who do I blame, them or the man who keeps picking them? BA save this club, that means save yourself.These forwards don’t deserve your loyalty. Give someone a go who will at least try to play as a forward and not sit out in the backline all bloody afternoon.
Shelley, good comments, sadly.
I would like to know how many minutes Scott has played in the games he has played in, also how many minutes Tim has played in his games.
Sadly while the contribution from Scott yesterday was better than in the early parts of the season, I have to say he needs to retire now to keep some semblance of how good a player he was rather than being a has been. I take no pleasure in saying that, but while he tried it really was not enough in content and time.
Tim, still runs hard and does his job, but unless I fell asleep with my eyes open, I cannot remember him taking part much apart from in the first half minus the 10 minutes bin time, which should have freshened him up.
There is a need for 80 minute players in the forwards, with Brown and Kaysa doing that yesterday outside of the above mentioned two players the rest of the forwards seemed to have played a good number of minutes equally but having two not contributing the same minutes must be a burden on those who have to make up for them, or basically carry them.
One thing sticking out like the wart on a witches nose is that as good a utility Smith is,he’s not a fullback. That is not denying his efforts but could be better at 6.
Big fan Shelley, but (as you would see above) I saw the game yesterday differently. I think we were a little out of sync at times (plenty of times) in the Panthers’ 20, and our attack was effectively poor, but it was not due to a lack of effort, and I think laying it at the feet of our forwards specifically is a mistake.
I do believe what you say has merit, but don’t believe it played as big a role as a lack of attacking cohesion or a lack of class (Gutho, Bev, Hayne).
I thought Browny, Kenny and even Manu (first time this year IMO) were pretty good yesterday, and only could only say that Mannah, Tepai and Terepo’s three errors weren’t.
But that’s me. I guess it’s the same game with a different point of view.
Manu was very very good in this match, if he continues in that vein also with Brown it augers well for going forward, need the remainder to also lift to their standards.
I have been looking at Alvaro and I know others have commented on this also but he seems to have trimmed down from last year, and has lost a little of his impact as a result???
BA promised changes after last week, and now we’ve had yet another loss with no changes will we see any?
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After that game Mannah, Hoffman, Scott and Peni all deserve a spell with Wenty.
And I really hope our front office is already organising a review of our football club setup because something is drastically wrong. Is it training, coaching, attack coaching, player acquisition, fitness?? We need to have a root cause analysis for this unacceptable season start and unfortunately heads have to be put on notice because another week of this and the pressure for someone to take responsibility by sacrificing their job will be overwhelmingly hard to ignore.
And sadly I can’t see where our next win will come from. We just look so far below the rest of the comp at the moment. It’s utterly depressing.
So far below rest ,Lost 3 games on penaltys with equal trys ?
Let’s not kid ourselves.
We are 5-0 down for the season. The only team left winless.
We have a points differential of -90. The next-worst team is the Bulldogs on -54 and then the Cows on -43.
We have conceded the second most penalties of any team outdone only by the Panthers, but we’ve received the 4th least penalties (so we’re by far the worst team in terms of penalties differential too).
On the headline figures there is a reasonable gulf between us and the next-worst team. Sugar coating this does us no favours in my opinion..
I think this is the core point, and the try statistics are nothing more than peripheral points of interest. It does speak to some extent that although we’re in the dreadful position of 0-5, other than Round 2 we haven’t been regularly blown off the park.
But yes, our record is still our core and primary concern.
I think we’ll see at least 3 changes this week, but that’s dealing with a lot less information than the coaching staff have at their disposal – and that’s something worth remembering.
True, true Mitch. I realise it’s not as simple as some of us emotional arm-chair coaches make it seem (myself included), with many more factors behind-the-scenes that we’re simply not privy to.
Who’d want to be a first grade coach nowadays? Poor BA.
He certainly does. I can’t remember where but I think I heard him describe it as his dream job. He’s a terrific coach and I suspect he’s learning more and more as this horror start to the season rolls on.
Heck, I lie awake at night thinking about the game, I can’t even imagine what it must do to him. He’ll get us out of this.
Sorry shelly but dont agree with most of your assesment, we won every stat bar completions 72/73 and therin lies the story ,we were actually the better side but the bungling backs couldnt put them away ,i dare say gutho ,bevan and hayne in that backline and we win well , not to mention taka ,the forwards did a pretty good job on the day against a far larger pack but i do agree we need more muscle up front ,the courage of our forwards today was outstanding it was the backs who failed to deliver the points but still they didnt fail in the effort dept either , take out manly debacle and tigers mixed bag and weve lost 3 games on penalty goals ,as for wholesale changes no way , tweak yep but big changes in team ,not for me , the changes that will change will be 3 starting backs missing ,guth bev and hayne plus taka and evans for mine , footnote shelly , we do need a couple of big boppers up front but theres none available ,im confident the clubs working on it ,actually tell me which forwards you would like to see promoted at the moment , you cant say something needs to happen without giving us your plan ! Sorry shelly but i thought forwards aimed up pretty well against monster pack putting us in position for backs to seal it and backs bungled it !!!!!!! As i said guth bev and hayne different result and no one points fingers at a pack that tried its heart out !!!!!
Having three of the backs, out I doubt that based on how JH has played since his return can make up for the lose of Semi, I think the big aspect of Semi’s departure that has affected the team, since Maitland trial is that the backs having relied on him as a turn round factor that could be relied upon is not there and they have not adjusted properly to it.
With French back next weekend, all going well, he’s not going to be the saviour and is not Semi but he has his own skills and while this is a bit of a change where I would like to have seen him at fullback, I would have him on the wing, and next to MJ, it will be a tight call who to drop, Hoff or Gennings.
A swap for Normz from 6 to fullback and have Smith in closer at 5/8.
I also believe that we miss Taka in the centres more than has realised.
Bev would have scored twice col and hayne would have brought experience in attack inside thier 30
The aspect that we bombed 4 tries hurt. The pass to the Hoffmans knock on was not great but its easier to catch the ball when you are running the line with your centre. Thing is that Bev would have been likely to be on the other wing, then again there were right side dropsies as well.
Hayne would bring experience but not convinced he is a centre, and still think we need Taka in the centres, Hayne on wing.
I’d guess that Taka’s centre days are (rightfully) over.
Yep
Nah, and the NZ selectors didn’t think so either. I also like the idea of Hayne on the wing.
If we actually brought Jarryd back as a replacement for Semi? Let him do what Semi did, I believe he can and in doing so on the left wing will not disrupt the rest of the backline that performed so well with Taka in the centres when both Bev and Gutho were out injured.
I think French, Gutho and eventually Hayne’s return will be big. I don’t agree with swapping Corey to the back though, that just creates more cohesion issues in attack we don’t need.
Although wins here and now is obviously the primary (and only real) concern, I suspect the club will have an eye on recruiting for next year in the back of their minds, as we currently have 13 of our top 30 off contract (which is a huge amount).
We had enough of everything to win but we lacked class today. Hayne, French and Gutho would have given us atleast another try. Injuries are part of footy. There are wingers that can dive from 2m short of the line , fly 1m over the sideline and put the ball down 1mm in the in goal. Sadly they don’t play for the Eels. Our finishing skills are poor.
Agree
This is my thoughts too. But as I said above, I don’t have a monopoly on the truth, it’s just my point of view.
Kevin couldn’t agree more. We lacked finesse, Hoffman is not a superstar and Jennings days of flying through the air are over. When we bring back some speed and class those tries will be scored.
On a completely different note, heard a wise man say that a new product should be developed, Twitter pls 10 (minutes). Time to reflect before sending!
Hi gang,
I am caught in the middle ground here (while the disappointment, dissatisfaction and hurt is not up for debate) I kind of agree with shelley that some of our forwards just aren’t offering much.
For those who defend Tim; can you point to another club/team captain who talks to the team less? Plays less minutes? Is so easily dismissed by the ref? Makes such amateurish mistakes more Than Tim? ..I’ll wait….
I have always had time for Tim Mannah – think he’s been great for the club and respect his contributions through tough times. So please don’t see this as bagging Him out.
We need more than 50metres 30 minutes 3 penalties a sin bin and zero big hits from our club captain. That’s a fact; We need more from Tim. He certainly didn’t deliver yday.
Beau Scott busts his gut and I personally would prefer He start as captain and be subbed off for Edwards/Moeroa because Beau’s job is seemingly to bring aggression, experience and shore up the D. But without a running game coming in late in the half is no good – He should be out there early on the edges terrorizing the opposition halves and organizing one sides D.
If he gets dropped really, we lose nothing in numbers at His current output and little by means of defensive grit because we’ve only showed it sporadically anyway.
So I suggest our co-captains are in trouble as Shelley has.
This may sound radical; but I’d be inclined to ask Corey to co-captain moving forward – why? The more directly responsible we make him for Parra’s results the better he will play. Don’t believe me? Watch the game where he was micd up on that show with sterling. Or the Broncos game in 2016 where they bashed Corey all game and he took it to them. Or stgeorge Round 2 2017. When Corey leads and grabs the game – we go well.
Peni Terepo made some brave carries but His hands let him down, Alvaro has lost too much weight it’s robbed him of some punch but boy he does a good job each week.
Moroea … what can you say, He needs to be more careful with the head knocks but where is that young barbarian who single handedly (literally) tore apart the Bulldogs forwards in 2015? Remember?? Maybe he needs a week off to regather some confidence.
Trex, Pritchard and Mau all were ok. But not great.
Kenny and Browny looked good. But my god, how is it that Browny can smash RCG scream like a banshee at the team and they all respond by playing with LESS aggression? If we had 3 Nathan browns we’d be unstoppable. He’s been left posted to take on opposition packs by himself this year – it will sap the aggression and energy out of him eventually. You can’t do it all alone.
As for the backs, I’m with Mitch and others – we miss Bev, Hayne, semi & gutho. Taka even was more of a threat in the centers than Auva’a, Hoffman combo.
Other suggestions? Vave/Matagi in for terepo. Gower in for Scott. Mannah to the bench. Alvaro/Evans to start.
If guth or Bev can play fullback then Smith has to be 14 and sub in for our exhausted Hookers. Fancy that Parra can’t score but both our hookers are exhausted ??? Rugby league; what a game!!!
Minimal changes would look like this:
8. Alvaro
9. Pritchard
10. Mannah
11. Ma’u
12. Williams (assuming Moeroa is concussed)
13. Brown
14. Smith (assuming there’s a fullback)
15. Edwards
16. Vave / Matagi / Evans
17. Scott / Gower
B. Some changes.
8. Alvaro
9. Prritchard
10. Vave
11. Ma’u
12. Williams (Moroea concussed)
13. Brown
14. Smith
15. Edwards
16. Mannah
17. Gower / Evans / Matagi
Just a suggestion or two….
I think it’s clear to see that Tim had a poor game yesterday, and I think there’s validity in considering a future Captain to take his spot in the coming years.
With that said, I think he has his place in the team going forward, just maybe as a defensive presence off the bench.
We basically have all our players off contract either this year or next (other than Brownie, Smith and Kane) so there is plenty of flexibility, but also a little bit of danger, too.
I did forget to mention I feel despite the lack of contributions from some we still managed to hold a pretty decent panthers pack in check – Kikau, Harris, RCG all were prominent but we dominated possession and position . Something a more fancied cowboys pack couldn’t do last week against Penrith.
So good on the lads for that – and credit where it’s due.
But we can certainly continue to improve vastly on ydays performance. Forwards and backs. Maybe changes are the way, maybe not. But something has to give eventually and hopefully before it’s too late.
Well said Sam. Agreed with this whole comment.
There’s been quite a bit of talk about a change of captains. Let’s play a hypothetical – who is the next captain for us after Timmy/Scott?
Those who have shown the passion over the past weeks for me have been Brown and Moses – but perhaps both of them are a little too hot headed. Gutho obviously comes to mind as well, but who knows how he’s going to return – a second ACL at his age could impact his form considerably (I hope, hope, hope it doesn’t obviously).
Who would be your pick?
Gutho. Easily.
If not him Nathan Brown.
Yep. What Mitch said.
Today was markedly better, Norman was good. Our speed at the play the ball is atrocious, let alone 70% of the dummy half balls were over the receivers head, terrible. Effort was great, to bomb two tries with the line open unbelievable. I still have faith, always will in the blue and gold
Just wondering Why don’t the halves have some tutorship from Joey or Matty Johns or some other known halves who can teach them additional knowledge? Would the cost be a factor for the club?
Well Mitch, you’ve certainly given us eager fans some food for thought. Here’s mine for what it’s worth. We need a little more punch through the middle. When did Suaia Matagi become not a first grade forward? It was said many times last year that all of our forwards are the same shape? Not quite in my observation.
Matagi is the standout different shape, short, stocky, powerful and effective in both attack and D where he gets between defenders carrying the ball in the middle and invariably gets over the ad line. He also hits like Browny when given an assignment (like he did on Martin Taupau last season against Manly)! I would start him with Mannah or Alvaro.
If Kane Evans is fit, there is another different body shape I would bring him off the bench (he had his opportunity to start and it doesn’t appear that he is there yet)
Tep and Trex are large human beings (one off the bench) and Manu pick themselves for effort and consistent impact imo. Which leaves us with Kedwards off the bench for his enthusiasm and the different style of play he brings.
That said what do you want from the rest of your middle rotation? You might like to lump Alvaro and Mannah in there with Peni and Beau Scott to pick 2 to keep and 2 to punt? At least that’s what I would do.
BA has a problem with the above stated realities and I’m sure he has considered these truths well before I’ve noted them, which was evidenced by the fact he selected both “different shapes off the bench in rounds 1 & 2 although Matagi may have missed the cut against Manly? Evans even had a starting game against Cronulla I believe.
All of this brings me back to Matagi. I believe he deserves the opportunity to start with a designated “mission to harass either Junior Paulo or Shannon Boyd by cutting one of them in half our making him try to run legless with someone coming over the top and then to take the metres available between them running off the back fence in attack.
I thought our forwards stood up as a pack well on Sunday but they are not our best pack.
Good luck BA. I don’t envy you your task telling one of our captains the truth that we can’t make the semis with both of them in our top 17.
Even when we lose, I love reading Post Game Grades.