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It is another tough Instant Reaction pocast after the Eels dropped this week’s game to the Titans in a 24-16 loss. Sixties and Forty20 breakdown an odd game where the Gold Coast were threatening a massive blowout victory before Parramatta somewhat rallied. Clinton Gutherson and Eels’ centurion Reagan Campbell-Gillard led the way but couldn’t quite drag the team over the line.
A loaded slate of Saturday action saw mixed results elsewhere for the Eels. Wins in the Jersey Flegg and the NRLW trial were offset by a tight loss in the HNWP and a horrific collapse in the NSW Cup. The boys recap each result and how it positions each respective team.
You guys can’t be commended enough for the effort you put in. Especially in times like this!!
My one point this week the more this year goes on. The more disappointed I get in Dyl. Genuinely can’t remember the last time he took over a game. He’s had all the time in world this year and just can’t seem to go to the next level. It hurts my soul. The obvious issue with effort in the pack is clear (RCG actually had a real good dig today)
We may not actually win again this year. I wonder if Ryles will use the bye round to come in and introduce himself to the club. Next year can’t come fast enough.
Keep up the good work boys!
Dylan hasn’t been as effective or progressed as much since the off field stuff last year unfortunately, but he is not the problem at parra. There’s not only a depth but a coaching issue going on that’s been happening for a long time, it’s impossible to win games with for years the worst edge defence in the nrl.
RCG played awesome and showed new coach Ryles “hey, I’m still up for it”
Wishing the boys got it done for Reggie’s 100th game for us.
The positives I thought we saw:
We had some decent moments in the flow of the game there, it didn’t always lead to points.
Blaize has a knack for getting trys or being in and around them it seems like.
RCG did his classic long runs into collision that we had been missing this was classic RCG. 👏
Dylan brown our most deadly player actually tried more than a few times to tear the opposition up, it didn’t work but he actually tried it more.
Asi did some decent kicking that out pressure on them near the try line and forced like drop outs.
The boys have simply lost all of their confidence & belief it seems like.
If RCG still ran like that every week he would be considered for playing origin.
Yeah, right now they are just in a place where they just can’t see where the next win is coming from. This happens to most teams at some point, we’ve just gotta bite down hard and get to that win.
I agree the belief but also we don’t look as fit as other teams
I’m wondering if our preparation for the season was also not done correctly
We still seem power focused and heavy legged
We go on to our backs very easily
I believe our roster is unfit for the current fast style of play with loads of 6 agains
We don’t look to have prepared our team specifically for the style of game / pace of today
I understand it’s a roster issue
But we always look more tired faster than other teams
Confidence is also low which makes this even worst
A few good tries or a win might help lift spirits
Losing exposes all your weaknesses, winning covers them up. So yes, we do look unfit, I don’t believe we are, but we are definitely built to win yesterday’s game, not tomorrow’s game.
Agree Muz,
Dylan did a lot of work off the ball and saved two tries with his cover defence. He’s doing so much off the ball he probably doesn’t have much left for attacking.
Reg was great.
Gutho playing busted.
Yeah dyl was very solid off the ball – it’s probably why we didn’t get flogged by 30 +
Muz, he was directly responsible for at least two try saves. Busted a gut tonight and every week in terms of effort.
60’s off the ball Dylan brown was vintage tonight in defence.
I believe this part of his game is why we didn’t lose by 30 +
Thanks Luk3182. I guess as Eels supporters we sign up knowing there are going to be times like these. There shouldn’t be, but there are.
Absolutely, I couldn’t agree more. TCT embodies eternal optimism, consistently finding a ray of sunshine in every initial assessment.
From BA’s impressive coaching to Josh Hodgson joining the club, and with Matt Arthur emerging as the best hooker our mighty club has ever produced—akin to the second coming of Harry Grant—Sixties is the person I’d want by my side if I were ever stranded in the desert without water. It’s not a mirage; it’s a miracle.
Avenger, I reckon you’ve just found a new level as far as back handed compliment is concerned. By the way, if you’ve listened to the podcasts this season I am sure you would have noted that we’ve combined balanced brutal honesty with the raw pain of what has transpired.
Sixties
Yes I have listened to every podcast and I agree you have been critical of our failed system in recruiting, however you have NEVER acknowledged or accepted that Brad Arthur had the biggest say in recruitment (This is according to our Chairman, not speculation).
In addition Mark O’Neill has never been identified directly as another culprit. You have only identified, ‘the system’ which makes it sound like you continually dance around the usual suspects. Why do you do that? You even had an opportunity to directly ask one of them in an interview during the pre season which we already discussed yet you answered that question by stating you were an online magazine for the fans. That was a lame excuse. Trust me, even magazines ask some tough questions.
Avenger, I own every comment, opinion or editorial choice that I make. I don’t expect you to understand the complexities that come with balancing fact, opinion and criticism on a supporter website. If you were in my position you might.
Regardless, I don’t expect everyone to like or agree with what I write or comment about. I just hope that there is an overall appreciation that The Cumberland Throw provides a breadth and standard of Eels content that is not available elsewhere. Let me assure you that it is actually far more challenging than people would imagine.
By the way Avenger, Hodgson had one of the best pre-seasons I’ve ever seen from an individual, especially a new arrival. Perhaps only surpassed by Ice, but with Ice he was a surprise packet, arriving without fanfare. Watching him was like “what have we secured here! How did the Warriors release him?”
It’s ancient history now with both. I could list everything that was witnessed about Hodgson – the others that raved about him, including other visitors to training, staff at all levels, fellow players. Mine was not an isolated opinion, far from it. He was a dynamic leader in everything he did. The bottom line was that when the season started, it didn’t manifest. In retrospect, the game had begun to get faster and Josh was older and plagued by injury. Again in retrospect we should have pursued Jeremy Marshall-King before he linked with the Dolphins, even way back when he might have been considered a depth signing.
Should we have let Mahoney go? Based on last year you’d say yes. He was offered a massive deal by the Dogs which we virtually matched, then he was offered even more by the Dogs. He was awful in 2023. Dogs fans were open in their criticism of him. He reacted in pressers about the fans. When he was with us, he was being targeted by opposition attacks and he’d had injury plagued seasons. We had never had anything approaching a 500K a year season from him, but the offers way exceeded that. Based on this year, he’s arguably in the best form of his career in a team on the rise. Would we have performed better with Reed in the team over the last two seasons? In 2024, I doubt it. He wouldn’t have had the defensive support around him that he has at the Dogs this year.
I couldn’t care less about Mahoney. JMK? Nobody knew he would kick on like he has, however Hodgson was a massive risk as was another BA brain fart in previous seasons, A Watmough. Apparently he had a great preseason too.
And please don’t start me on the former Rouse Hill Rhinos currently in our top 30. How are they going? They all must have collective BA Stockholm Syndrome.
Million dollar question folks:
Can Jason Ryles and the new coaching staff turn this team around next year without cleaning out the roster?
I agree on Dyl. Definitely is having a dig. It’s hard I guess to dominate behind slow play the balls and I think he’d benefit greatly from a running hooker.
Rookie coaches have had far worse rosters given to them. There needs to be a complete change in attitude from top to bottom. We need a complete different approach from the previous coach. However he can absolutely do it. You have a rep level halves pairing straight off the bat and I bunch of young guys way out of form just looking for someone to give them confidence.
Doubt it happens next year and about 70% of the roster needs a turn over but 2026 isn’t out of the question for finals etc
It’s not the fast play the balls he misses, it’s the flat, hard, infront Reed Mahoney service. He isn’t the only player who hasn’t been the same since we lost Reed (see Lane, See Paulo) but we have to deal with it. It’s Mark O’Neil’s fault… well the people who employed him’s fault, then MON’s fault – and it appears the club isnt interested in rectifying that.
I think if we signed Api instead of Hodgson we would be in a much better position now.
If we could Look back into the due diligence process. I just wonder what was ignored in Hodgson’s case? Who made this call? Was it BA? Or MON ? Someone got it badly wrong and it cost big time.
Short memories and missing the point. Hodgson had a fantastic preseason and he promised the world. No due diligence was going to change that but it is nice to blame someone. In someways I thought it was a masterstroke BUT it didn’t work. Shit happens.
Subsequent attempts to secure a hooker with a difference have failed to some extent. Personally I have faith in MA being a change master, but that might not work either…. again early days but shit happens (can).
We need to remain optimistic and not give up. If we can address the forwards middle defence and the speed of the backline, we are a lot closer than some may believe.
Yes, this will require recruitment but the days of us chasing a Harper are not going to happen. We need a Cameron Murray type forward, easier said then done, but Hopgood in and Lane out would make a difference. I know Lane improved from a middle bench position in this last game, but he is not the type of forward to go ‘forward” with.
Hopefully the coach can see this and adjust accordingly.
I do agree solid dummy half service from Reed was a massive part of our success at parra, his service was very good and defensively sound in the middle.
He’s now an origin dummy half. Another good player that had years left of good football that we let go of, to prioritise long term contracts for old forwards.
I don’t blame Reed for leaving, maybe he could see the writing on the wall?
Reed left for a lot more money and the Chinese feed at the Canterbury Leagues Club.
Yeah a lot more money, but let’s be honest. Was he worth it? Probably.
Would we have played finals last year and been better this year if he was still here?
Probably.
Put it this way, there’s plenty of players who we kept who are past it and still on more money and add significantly less value to the team for the cost.
I’m of the belief the eels also need a proper high quality hooker to succeed again.
You see top teams who are in the top 4 and the end of the year.
They rarely have bad or average dummy halves.
It’s a crucial position, we haven’t looked the same since Reed left us.
As much as I didn’t want to admit it to myself for a long time.
Muz,
Perhaps I’m blinded by my disappointment Reed left. He was my favourite Eel. But once he went back to the club who didn’t think he would make it he became persona non grata to me. My wife says I hold on to things and grudges for too long. She’s probably right.
You ask a few questions around if Reed stayed and I can’t argue with your answers. But was/is he worth the reported difference in offers – from my dim recollection it was pretty significant six figure annual difference in offers. Would he have stayed if we offered a little more – who knows. Which contracts should the Eels rejigger, not offer to accommodate that – I know a lot of people have strong opinions around who should have been let go.
I agree with you that all good teams have good hookers. Let’s face it all teams need a good spine to be ultra competitive. Look at the Broncos without Reynolds. So for the Eels, who is coming through, or available that can become that sort of player and does Parramatta’s management have the wherewithal to commit to developing him or bringing him in? I guess time will tell.
In the meantime I sit waiting for my 21 year old son to experience what I have four times over – an Eels premiership and the happiness and joy that that brings.
Don’t forget Reed was not the most popular boy around town (still isn’t) there was a definite clash between him and Moses….both have moved on Ce La Vie!
Poppa I can tell you that Reed and Mitch are still good friends.
To some level, yes. We shouldn’t be 16th, we have far too much talent for that. I think Baz can turn it round this year if we can just jag that first win.
However, long term there needs to be some serious surgery on the roster. Good news is that the likes of RCG, Junior, Lane, Matterson et al still have trade value. They can still be quality players in the right environment. It’s just not here at the Eels, at least not all of them. There are teams out there though who would want them individually, Mark O’Neill needs to find them.
Brett I agree some of our forwards would probably be useful or wanted by tigers or bulldogs even.
But what I have analysed during the last few weeks even when Moses is playing.
We not only have a defensive issue we all know about.
There’s also an actual attacking issue.
We go side to side and sides now have figured it out – that we go side to side and it’s nearly always a winger who scores.
They simply slide and anticipate our attack will try to go around them not through.
You’ll notice our attack near the try line even when Moses has been in – has been poor.
Even with more possession and endless sets in the red zone we lack points.
There’s not only defensive problems but we need all new attacking systems added in the pre season under the new coach,
With that field position & possession,
The Melbourne storm even with their reserve graders taking up half of the team.
Would put on 15-30 more points per game than us with those similar opportunities.
Theres mass need for new attacking coaching and new formations.
I’m not suggesting this is the main problem but it’s one of them.
Defence & speed obviously needs to be first priority for next year.
But our attack is sideways, the only way we seem to score usually is by the rare occasion there’s space for a winger to cross out wide.
Im a fan of him as a person – but for this reason I’m hoping baz isn’t our attacking coach next year.
I believe we need all new ideas.
Penrith or storm can lose their best players for months on end and stil win most games.
We can hardly win any game even when our best players are on.
This is not only a depth issue as is often suggested.
We have vastly weaker systems being taught & deployed in the NRL team.
The proof is in the pie so to speak.
Even in the GF we got totally showed up so bad it didn’t even look like we belonged there.
Once we couldn’t win the collision we had no plan B, we looked totally out of ideas.
Cooper Cronk said it looked like we had no plan b if plan a didn’t work.
I’m proud of our coach how far he took us but we probably over achieved for how we have been for far too long.
Forever we never succeed in the finals usually, because good teams simply have too much class for us.
We have had the worst edge defence for years.
Teams know if they get a set play or two in our red zone they’ll Score usually.
You can’t possibly succeed at the highest levels of the NRL with attack that almost solely (now) relies on an overlap for a winger scoring.
And a defence so weak it leaks tries virtually each time you attack us in the red zone.
I’m of the belief the club needs a full clean out of all the old ideas and rebuild.
A constantly sideways attacking system and virtually non existent defences on the edges – is a clear indication we are in desperate need for all new systems (not just players)
Good question Muz.
I’d have to say release Paulo and Lane to UK and buy Trey Fuller and Remis Smith and Iro as depth.
The simple things are fitness, edge defence, play the ball speed ours and there’s. The wrestle. Markers, Basic controlling the ruck all these are very poor. Holding the ball into contact and wingers scoring tries is also quick fixes.
Look what Flanagan has done at Dragons- in his first year. Just shows what a football brain can do.
True Pete, and flanno at dragons is a good example – but he’s also a very experienced
There would be NRL teams that would take Junior or Lane. I could see Manly or Melbourne using Junior, and I reckon the Raiders or Tigers seeing value in Lane. We’d have to pay some of the freight obviously, but they’d take them I’d reckon. I think the Dolphins & Knights would take Matterson, maybe Melbourne as well. The Dragons would love RCG.
Thanks for the podcast gents. There’s not much more or less that could’ve been said.
Relief is what I felt too, I was feeling dread before the game, my fear was we would end in the record books for all the wrong reasons.
Individual performances are all that’s left to analyse, Brown gave everything he had, I thought he was a standout, RGC wasn’t far behind him, Gutho busted a gut again. There was a number of players that stood up individually which was pleasing.
Sad to see Charlie go off injured, I hope he’s not out for long.
I’m not sure what Bazz is doing with Arthur, as you boys said, what’s the point playing him for a few minutes? It’s about 2025 now, Boods needs game time so he can hit the ground running next season.
This season can’t finish fast enough, more dread and hopefully relief to come.
The only game to look forward to is against the Tigers, who would have thought we would be competing to avoid the spoon in 2024.
I reckon we’ll have to find a win before we play the Tigers. If we go into the last round against them at Leichhardt on equal points, the outcome probably won’t be good.
Sorry Brett, my reply wasn’t directed at you.
Hey Brett yeah I agree clubs would take some of them, but I guess my msg was that they would not take them for what we are paying.
I don’t believe some of our forwards are bad to have on the roster, it’s more a price to value aspect that’s concerning.
Paulo and lane and Matto are on bigger pays than some of the most impactful forwards in the entire NRL.
Paulo is on the kind of money now as his pay apparently goes up per season, he’s probably on something close to Payne haas or big Tino.
And he is a bench player, lol.
No offence to him personally, but from facts perspective that’s seemingly his usual position.
You can’t have bench (or) low impact starting forwards who are bench players.
On around a million dollars a year.
I agree matto, paulo, lane, on appropriate contracts are not bad players to have on out roster.
It’s the fact we pay them premium contract fees and get Wish . Com quality services in return (in 2024)
We are paying Mercedes Benz prices for a Hyundai i30 performances. 🤣
At 500 a year or around that – some of our forwards would make decent players for some clubs.
The issue is – no clubs will pay them close to what we do. As you mentioned.
We signed them on with elite performance expectations.
And ultimately got bench players as a result shortly afterwards.
Jason will be fighting off wooden spoons again if we keep all these forwards on for next year.
Things will not change unless the roster does – as we saw this year and last year.
Are not* bad to have on a roster
To be fair to the club, these players were all resigned either prior to or immediately after the 2022 GF. Imagine the outrage if we let say RCG go to the Dolphins like he very nearly did and he absolutely killed it ?
The issue isn’t how much we’re paying our core players, Moses, Brown, Gutho, RCG, Junior, Lane, Matterson & Sivo, they earned it, the issue is we aren’t getting enough from players 11-30. Our kids aren’t as good as other clubs kids, our backups aren’t as good as other teams backups.
They would NEVER come to us as depth.
Muz, the roster requires somewhere between a tweak and a clean out.
I thought Dylan tried hard, he saved a couple of tries chasing in cover and gave it his all. It’s unlikely he will ever be a controlling half but I’d rather have him in blue and gold than not.
This aside there was little to be happy about, Ryles has plenty of work in front of him to modernise our style of play. I can’t see that being possible without changes to our squad.
It’s been said before but Mark O’Neill has left our roster awfully imbalanced. Completely unacceptable for a club with our resources, juniors and claims of being a development club sending out an NRL side with 2 wingers tonight who, with respect, are fringe reserve grade/Ron Massey cup level. Outside back depth has been an issue for several seasons and O’Neill has been unable to address it.
Hey mate,
It’s not only MON to blame I think
The old coach even tho I liked him – prioritised a big too heavy forward roster
The claim he could never get players is bogus
They never failed to snap up every forward that came up they needed
Depth upon depth for forwards every season (compared to backs or halves)
All suited to the power playing style
This notion that he just sits back and won’t sign backs for no reason is also lacking context
The problem is our forwards have taken up so much of the cap
Most teams DO NOT have so much cap space taken up by forwards – especially old ones
It’s said paulo with his pay going up yearly
Might be on over $1 million dollars per year now
Them you’ve got lane & matto on $750k + apparently
Then moses is on over $1 million per year
They simply have over spent on forwards and have huge money in Moses
as well players like paulo & lane who do not pull their weight for their pay grade
So I’m not suggesting the head of football isn’t involved in it
But do you really think of our old coach didn’t want these players
He would have got them all signed up on massive contracts as part of the team long term?
There’s a massive cap imbalance in the team where some players get paid a fortune
Then the other players (like our backs)
Are reserve grade level players
Players like Spencer Leniu or Liam Martin
Are on LESS money than players like Paulo & Sean Lane
Paulo is on more money than Jerome Hugh’s and approximately the same as Big Tino fa’asuamaleaui
We have a dramatically imbalanced roster
Out players are either the near highest paid players for their positions in the NRL
Or reserve graders playing first grade who would struggle to get a starting spot at almost any other club
There’s no balance & harmony not only in salary cap
But playing styles
Huge forwards then slow backs
Paul Gallen was on 9 saying how moses can’t be blowing up players who are failing
Because he’s taking up a huge salary over a million per year
The club simply doesn’t have the cap space to have top players all around them
The fat cats in our team are taking up huge amounts of money in the cap
In any club there’s individual players on massive salary’s
Usually they get surrounded by average players
The old coach wanted all these players who are on huge money
If BA didn’t want then they would not be here
There’s been a systemic failure at the club
The head of football obviously can’t go signing a full roster or some fast backs fast
Because apparently our cap space is tight
Go look at how much budget we have in our forwards and say moses
Then it completely makes sense why they constantly have had reserve graders in the backline & bench
We can’t fill a top 30 and apparently it’s because we have too much invested in the players already at hand
They prioritised people like paulo on giant contracts for their positions with clauses that make their pay keep increasing
And didn’t account for the fact he was going to become a average performing shortly after
Sad to say it – but some players on our team are over paid
And we have no balance
It’s bad management by all of them and not just one person – Imo
Mate no doubt some level of responsibility lies with BA also, but he has paid the price and is no longer at the club. O’Neill’s primary role js roster management and the roster has been imbalanced for most of his watch, there is no escaping he has failed.
Outside of the outside back issues we have also failed to lock down our juniors. O’Neill has claimed we are a development club yet this year alone he has overseen Sanders leaving, Blaize debut with a player option declined (a player option for a pathways player, no other club would ever allow this) and our most promising junior forward in Guymer also remains unsigned for 2024. Amateur stuff from O’Neill.
Every club has high earners. Cleary is on more than Moses. Our issue is the lower end of our payroll. The top end of the payroll is rarely the problem, the problem is almost always at the bottom. Unlike the Panthers, or the Storm, or the Roosters, or pretty much every other team, we simply do not get enough value from players 11-30. That’s where a lot of our problems stem from, and that’s where our pathways are simply not getting it done.
We need a dedicated Director of Player Development whose responsibility is finding the best 14 year olds in the world, sign them to our junior rep squads, and indoctrinate them for six years in The Eels Way. Then he needs to build an elite coaching system. We need a head coach and two assistants for each of our five junior rep squads, overseen by a Coaching Director who reports directly to the DPD. The DPD then coordinates with the NRL head coaches & the GM over progression & promotion.
Under this model we not only have a consistent pipeline of men’s & women’s players, we also have a consistent pipeline of coaches & potential football department executives.
That’s development.
Brett, whilst I agree with you.
Players like Spencer Leniu, Angus Crichton, Liam Martin, Pat Carigan, Reuben cotter, and many more.
These players are on less, of similar to players Like Paulo, Lane, Matto.
You cannot possibly say that our cap is Balanced correctly in our roster.
Of course there is high priced players in every team.
But our players on 750k to Paulos alleged (possibly) 1 million now with his pay increase yearly per contract.
These guys are not even close to giving the eels significant value for that price.
The proof is that most good clubs would not have a starting spot for those example 3 players just mentioned in the eels forward pack.
Many Top 8 teams would not even have a bench spot for those players if we offered them for free to them.
I know this sounds harsh, but if we are dealing with facts only.
The eels are significantly out of balance with the roster.
Enormous amount of cap space stuck in forwards who simply are not even close to being rep standard in origin for example.
The only forward we have now who’s SOO standard is in his second year of NRL and is our injured.
Paulos on the kind of money other majority of other clubs are only looking to pay that for an elite starting prop – who starts & makes a significant impact.
Paulo isn’t a starting prop anymore, matto and lane are for the most part now henchmen starting forwards for the eels.
There’s no sting head coach of club manager who would disagree with these facts we unfortunately face.
The eels have got one of (if not) the most too heavy roster in the comp.
Coincidentally, it’s alleged that we do not have cap space to sign backs or fill the 30 man roster.
Whilst I agree the pathways results has proven insufficient.
The clubs said to have minimal cap space, and a ridiculous too heavy roster.
Of forwards who are now you can argue, seen as bench players.
The clubs issues I agree are deep and vast, in terms of pathways.
But they have huge amounts of money in so many bad players.
This is reportedly largely why our backs in both depth and for starting positions.
Are largely at NSW cup standard.
No other clubs invest so heavily into forwards and have fringe NRL players for backs year after year.
The budget has been allocated to forwards in an unbalanced manor if we look into it, compared to other successful teams.
I’m with you that there needs to be changed, 100%.
But the actual cap issue at the moment stopping them from signing all these quality & depth backs to fill a 30 man roster everyone keeps asking for.
They apparently can’t do it because they do not have a lot of wiggle room left on the roster.
We’ve got forwards on over 750k per year – who the tigers & bulldogs would possibly not even be interested in.
It’s reported some of our players have been getting shopped to super league.
E.g sivo, and reportedly RCG was being considered.
That’s the state of our roster at the moment.
They have to consider shopping our high paid players to the super league.
Because for the size of their contracts.
NRL clubs largely would not be interested.
It’s a bit of a disaster.
When many of our players are told to leave they are only fit for the super league.
That’s how long we keep them for, or how average some of them are.
Sivo & Waqa are other goor examples.
We keep players on too much money for too long, even when it’s clear our club should have made tough decisions earlier.
I disagree. You put Junior in the Storm system and he’s back in the Origin conversation. Same with RCG. They are getting paid because they took us to a GF and we simply could not afford to lose them.
The other players you mentioned are all playing for clubs that are in the position to say no to them. We are not. And even if we did, we’d just have to pay the same money to recruits because we don’t have a Spencer Leniu or Keano Kini coming through our pathways.
And that’s the real issue.
Sorry for so many spelling mistakes Brett, typing while on the move.
I can’t agree with the Dylan Brown love in some comments. Look, we all know what an effort player he can be and he has talent up the wahzoo. But he has played 115 odd games and if you had to list the 100 games he has tried hardest in, none would be this year. And what is worse is he promised to make it up to his team mates this year and he hasn’t. If he wants to explore his options, while it pains me to say it, I’m ok with it.
As for the game. RCG was a warrior again.
Gutho showed up for 15 minutes at the end. Not going to bag him as he tries 9 times out of 10. But we missed his effort tonight.
Blaze can’t be wasted in the centres. Put him on the wing where he can touch the ball more, or back to fullback and wear the mistakes as he makes defensive errors and learns, but don’t waste him in the centres.
No attack. A try from a turnover (well done Blaze), a push over from Will and a push over from Gutho. We never looked threatening. Ever.
While it was great we didn’t capitulate after the first 20 minutes we have to face the facts. We may not have 16 first grade calibre players on our various rosters in the club. And the frightening thing is the CEO claiming we have a “strong roster” when earlier this week announcing our new coach.
Brett, I don’t get all the DB hate circulating around the place – not having a go at you personally as you’re pretty balanced in your comments, moreso some other real idiots. It’s pretty simple, he’s a running 6, yet to be able to take advantage of that part of his game, he needs to have quality ball and, most importantly, quality hole runners around him. He’s had a heap of different backrowers and centres surrounding him this year and to be fair, none of them have held up their part of the bargain to any great extent. You put some hole runners around him and he’s a different player – just look at what happened at the Kiwis. At the moment, the defence knows he’s more than likely going to try and run it as he has no options, but you give defences a look where they don’t know if he’s going to A) hit an edge backrower running an outside in line, B) go out the back to a centre that is able to beat a player 1 on 1, or C) run it himself, and then you have a whole different story. He just hasn’t had those options and he’s a marked man because of it.
There’s some people saying the Eels would be better off without him, he’s on far too much money, he’s way overrated etc etc, but they clearly have bugger all knowledge of how rugby league actually works. Anyone blaming DB for not taking control of games and getting wins is sadly lacking in intelligence about footy – much the same as they layed, and continue to lay, the blame solely at the feet of BA.
Lack of depth reared its head across the top 2 grades, which were well covered by both of you. In cup we were leading comfortably but once Morgan Harper went off the lack as usual any replacements in the 3/4 line, it fell to pieces with the structure unable to cope and adjust with the Warriors taking full advantage.That needs to be addressed big time once the season finishes, but lack of action previously has left the cupboard bare of transfers in, so promotions may be more important.
A lesson learnt for the age group players moving up to play senior footy, it’s a different game and they now know what needs to done , apart from Greig we’re lacking experienced leaders, no expectation of Lussick assisting unfortunately. Promising debut from Alemeddine which hopefully helps him higher up the grades.
Well we managed to last past the 60 minute mark at least, pity we didn’t start playing till the 20th !!!!
Mulitalo, like Tago last week, tried hard, but is clearly short of real talent. John Folau, Jake Tago, Alonzo Mulitalo, why do we end up with the less talented brothers all the time ?
Not sure Talagi is well suited to the centres, but it may be the best option for now.
Just keep bringing the kids in Baz.
Like many I feared a blow out but the team got back into the game. If only Penisini did not go for that hail mary pass. Things were happening up to then.
The team is playing with little confidence and I wonder if they are struggling to move on from “chase the collision” to different style of play. I do think this is part of Dylan’s struggles. He is trying hard but needs to be “unlocked.”
Looking at the glass half full, a fully fit squad with some opportunistic buys before 2025 to correct squad imbalances – they do happen – will challenge for the eight. Just look at the turnaround from 2018 to 2019.
I think moving Dylan to fullback, even temporarily, might be the key to unlocking him.
A reverse Lockyer then? Could work but I would like to see how Dylan goes in a revamped attacking system.
Yep. It’s not without precedent. Reece Walsh was a halfback in the pathways.
It doesn’t even have to be permanent, but it might freshen him up.
Did we actually play better without paulo there?
Not having goes at him, but I’m trying to figure out why I think we held up better in terms of pts scored against us.
I thought most of our forwards played decent in terms of effort, particularly RCG.
Bumbling play invited the Titans to a quick 18 blot advantage, but after that we showed they (the Titans) didn’t have much, the thing they did effectively is a Hasler trademark, line speed in their own red zone, we just don’t handle it well. I thought a few times ‘ can’t the the ref see them pushing it?’ The guy in the headgear (Haas I think) was 2 mtrs n front of his mates, but in most games the whistle is put away, if it’s the same for both teams OK, the only problem is that our end it doesn’t matter, the ball just gets spun wide and we falter.
And nothing to do with anything, but I’m waiting for the first ref to blow the whistle for not playing the ball properly, seems to have been consigned to the ‘don’t worry about it’ basket, which I don’t really care, but some efforts are nothing like a play the ball.
Hopefully this is the last game Asi plays, thought his presence in attack was dreadful, passing especially, many drop balls were from his dreadful slow speed passing, and they worked him over in attack, his kicking display was ordinary and with his speed attempting a chip and chase was silly on the 3rd or 4th tackle,
Who replaces him? They won’t use sander’s probably because he’s leaving. We do not have any depth I’m afraid
It’s funny, he actually looks threatening when he takes on the line, he’s a big body, decent acceleration and a good fend, then he suddenly remembers what number is on his back and tries to become the next Cliffy Lyons. Shouldn’t be surprising since his best spot is fullback. His passing technique is just awful.
Brendan Hands actually looked ok at 6 when DJ went off.
It’s funny, he actually looks threatening when he takes on the line, he’s a big body, decent acceleration and a good fend, then he suddenly remembers what number is on his back and tries to become the next Cliffy Lyons. Shouldn’t be surprising since his best spot is fullback. His passing technique is just awful.
I thought the forwards probably outplayed their opposition. RCG, Matterson and Labe ran hard. Dylan was good. Penisini did some good things, most notably his try. We got done on the flanks but not laying any blame there. The two wingers tried their hearts out.
It’s groundhog day watching the same 2 tries cost us the game each week.
Winger comes up, centre comes in 6 points down.
Until the backs learn to hold the line and drop back instead of rush up this is all we will ever get.
My biggest disappointment was Penisini. So much talent, so little effort.
I’ve been standing up for the forwards all year. RCG would do NSW proud on Tuesday, he’s a class act.
Neither of those tries were the fault of the winger or centre. On both occasions they had us for numbers because Carty’s lateral quickness is compromised meaning Dylan had to stay attached to Campbell a fraction longer than he’d like, meaning Penisini HAD to stay in on Fifita which meant Mulitalo HAD to come in on Kelly which of course left Khan Perieira free. But Carty had to play tighter because the Titans were just rolling through our middle too easily.
It starts with our complete lack of ruck control, teams know they can just roll through us unmolested. Eventually we just run out of players. Better to be stripped on the touch line where the kicker might miss than under the posts.
Agreed. It’s all to do with ruck and lack of inside pressure. Look at the first try. Guymer is only one who puts on good inside pressure while doorey is being lazy and so dyl and rest of edge remain tight – ultimately get stripped.
We need much better wrestling/ruck control and line speed (doorey, lane, matto, rcg, junior are all so as hell in the middle)
It was 18 -0 when Carty came on not on him
Correction, it was Doorey. But my point stands.
It’s a good point you made Brett.
The core beginnings of our failures you can see begin in and around the ruck.
Our players usually aren’t fit or fast enough to get back inside or get back into marker after they get tired.
I don’t want to repeat myself because it sounds like we are bashing the old coach or the players.
But the playing roster we have not only in the backs, but in the forwards.
Are not suitable for a side to have good defensive statistics week in week out.
The big power / collision type roster we have got stuck with isn’t an effective defensive unit due to size, age, lack of speed.
We seemingly lose the ruck weekly now, it looks like teams have also truly worked us out in this respect.
All teams have to do in order to beat us is keep attacking around the ruck & behind markers.
Typically our forwards can’t get back into market or back on side as the game plays out.
Then our edges have to move inwards to make up the deficit number of players inside of them who can’t get back on side, or tired.
Then, once we start to compact inwards.
They simply shift the ball out wide and we are either shorter for numbers.
Or, our backs make defensive reads that aren’t up to a high level NRL standard if we are dealing with the facts.
I know our backs get a blasting.
But it’s not always their fault.
The clubs built this roster of power players who aren’t mobile, young or fast to keep up the defending pace when teams apply pressure to us set after set.
I’m not going to be a clown and only blame MON or only blame BA here.
It’s a strategic plunder from the club themselves too, for letting this go on so long.
The writing was on the wall last year and they didn’t bother to try shop many of the players off who were in decline.
I understand there’s a 3 or 4 person committee & the coach who mastermind & decide on R & R decision making.
But the board & CEO sat on their hands and kept all of the same people employed who…
(All of us who paid attention)
Could see we’re making absolutely poor decisions for the club.
Some questionable signs we all saw as red flags over the last few years:
– The signings over the last few years of almost ALWAYS forwards (hardly many backs
– Absolutely avg quality signings, almost exclusively reject / unwanted players on the market
– Letting go of very high quality players and replacing them with players often with even 50% of the ability
– Signing on soon to be old players on huge contracts and prioritising them, whilst letting go of younger players who wanted more money
The list goes on.
Our clubs board & CEO seen all of this take place.
And still didn’t sack anybody when all of us could see that a decline was almost 100% certain after the grand final.
Due to the heavy roster losses & who our replacements were.
Our board & CEO failed us by not stepping in and sacking either the R & R commitee, HOF, or BA earlier.
All of us could see something dramatically bad was taking place last year.
And most serious eels fans I spoke to who understand the game before this year started – expected us to finish outside the top 8 due to roster.
Our clubs higher ups watched on as all of this happened and sat on their hands.
All of us serious eels fans who understand the game have been able to predict BEFORE the last two seasons have even begun.
(Including TCT)
That we had significant depth & roster issues in key positions.
And they just let this go on.
All the way to the point we are now back fighting for avoiding a wooden spoon again.
This was all within only TWO YEARS!
When you go and order food at a restaurant and they under cook your food two times.
The manager doesn’t come out telling you that they will sack the worker and it’s all his fault.
They take accountability and ensure the issue will be resolved.
Our leadership Simply blamed BA and took no accountability.
Our clubs higher ups have sat back watching this stagnant roster crumble in weakness in depth & signings.
When we ALL could see it.
They then wait until we are basically last in the comp before taking some form of serious action.
You could bet your life savings.
At any other large club who’s not ran poorly.
That the clubs leadership would not have let this happen.
Or, they would have stepped in earlier to avoid the inevitable.
Clubs boards & CEO’s are supposed to overlook these individuals decisions & results.
They are not supposed to sit back and wait until the whole ship has virtually sunk.
Before they step in and device it’s time to take action.
This is absolutely poor leadership from the eels up at the head office.
The evidence of this is displayed when they continue speaking to the media claiming we have a strong roster still.
This is completely untrue and borderline delusional.
We have GOOD PLAYERS, on this roster.
But not a good roster in of itself.
I’m of the belief that our edged defence is obviously not great.
But –
It’s not only their fault.
Our middles generally lose the ruck in defence in every single game.
There’s a significant speed and fitness disadvantage we have in every single game.
The club needs to stop lying about how good our roster is.
We have the worst defence in the NRL and probably the worst yardage gained or bottom 3.
There’s no universe in which a club with a good roster is sitting equal last.
A good roster even without a head could land themselves in the top 8.
It’s beyond ridiculous that they can stand there and watch our team perform at present.
And claim that it’s a good roster.
We do have great players on the roster.
But the balance & depth of the roster is the worst in the whole NRL.
Even the tigers have better halves & backs depth than us.
It’s insanity. Lol
I don’t want to be doom or gloom.
I just want to see leadership.
Where they accept we have roster & depth issues.
Then say they will work to fix it up.
Some accountability goes a long way.
Most of us fans would have significantly more faith in them and our future.
If they could simply show us that they understand the issues like we do.
Breaking news.
Jason Ryles is reportedly set to request an immediate release from the Strom as their assistant coach. This will allow him to start planning his 2025 campaign with the Eels ahead of schedule.
Via: Sydney Morning Herald
Good news for us eels fans?!
Great news.
Will he be able to influence any defensive improvements before the years end to provide some hope for us eels fans?
Avoiding a wooden spoon is beyond just important it’s absolutely a must!
One can only hope 🤞 fingers crossed
There’s a technical aspect but you can only work with the cattle we have which is a concern
Tank 100% agree, this is also true. It will be a hard task.
Muz, he’d only be working on 2025, and that might include finalising aspects such as his roster and staffing.
Forty was on the money when he speculated that JR was a coordinator and therefore a possibility to get an early release.
For me the Storm probably are happy to get him away from there squad and staff.
Sixties it’s normal management practice as you mentioned
60’s I was hoping he might be able to help maybe sooner, but if not that makes sense.. just a hopeful eels fan 😀
We are garbage because of our recruiting and signing a bunch of guys to contracts longer then should of.
We all.knew singing 4 x older forwards who all have had inconsistent careers to 4yr deals was dumb dumb.
So what signing an old hooker who was dusted.
Gutherson is cooked. Been great but cooked. He took the club to the cleaners with his 850k contract. Sometimes short term pain for long term gain is the better option. And lastly Sivo. Another inconsistent player given a 4yr deal.
Then look at the halves back ups and your backline back ups. Putrid really. They relied on JA and Asi. And right now have two Ron Massey cup wingers playing NRL.
BA had plenty of say on recruiting and extensions. Just like giving J.Lussick a 2.5yr deal. The bloke couldn’t get a starting spot in the UK.
LETS HOPE RYLES HAS A BETTER EYE FOR TALENT
Top 30 is a mess and it’s possible none of our 3 grades plays finals. Embarrasing for a club our size.
It appears a lot of players have put their own contracts over the club.
Successful teams players often put club first and will try to fit into a cap that makes the team successful, not all players do it… but many in successful teams.
Our players do not seem to do that. They’ve milked the cap more or less for the value some players bring (due to their age, form, etc).
Change is due and Ryles needs to shift the culture away from salary vultures, no more old players on long contracts especially ones who only perform truly good in contract years.
We/club’s decision makers seem to fall for every trick in the book.
Interesting thought Muz. This could very well be one of the key factors to our inconsistency throughout the season. The players are there for the money, which is already banked. They don’t regard success as playing as a team and winning premierships. If this is indeed the case, change is a must, not a nice to have. This is going to take time however and there could be more bad times ahead still.
I have faith that our problems can start to improve from next year though, starting with a mindset change sparked by a new voice in Ryles, and probably a new captain in Moses.
I think you’ve always got to be careful when judging player motivations. I think if you were to be ask every Eels player they would tell you that winning is the only thing they care about, and they would mean it. Now that doesn’t mean that bad habits haven’t slipped in and don’t need correction, clearly that has been the case, but I don’t think bc any of them are just going through the motions, certainly not consciously. The effort is clearly there, but they are just in a hole right now and can’t see their way out.
One highlight of Blaize in the game for me was seeing video of the intercept taken from behind the Eels defence.
The take and then the pass were brilliant and pure instinct. Instinct is something that can’t be taught.
He took the catch on the tip of his fingers.
He has got natural talent & instinct that wins you games, the kids going to become a good player.
I’ve got news Ryles is getting Bronson Garlick Signed on a 3 year deal from 25’ as our starting hooker.
Let’s see how this plays out it hasn’t been made public yet, hopefully it gets confirmed.
We haven’t had a proper specialist, in from & young starting hooker since Reed left us.
Hopefully it’s true and gets confirmed.
Muz he is hardly young. Turns 29 in December. I agree with you he would be good backup.
He was a late bloomer and debuted later than most. If it is true.
I thought he was younger than that, yeah that’s not ideal age wise. I thought he was 24 for some reason. Lol
I guess if je hasn’t played a huge amount of games, maybe years left on the legs than Say Josh Hodgson hopefully 😁
No good blocking boods arthur. Ba wouldn’t be pleased lol
With the new coach Boods will probably continue to develop at nsw cup which is probably ideal.
Sixties,
Your comments around Lidcombe Oval bring back awful memories for me. I never once left that ground having watched a Parramatta victory. Worse still, Dad always seemed to be able to bring along a Navy mate who was a mad magpie supporter who would just rub it in during the car trip home.
Ditto, Graeme Olling copped a terrible work over from the Wests pack one Sunday afternoon, under the Terry Fearnley ‘no retaliation’ policy. The ref disappeared, Raudonikis and co thought it was a picnic. Giving those blokes an open cheque was life threatening. I drove home half-comatosed.
Saw a great video on social media of Dylan Brown staying back after the game in the cold and giving his shirt to a young fan. He was interacting with the fans and was a real champion with a Great attitude. This really makes fans happy.
Well done Dylan!
He seems like a down to earth and decent bloke to the fans. Dylan’s defensive efforts over the weekend were very good too, him and RCG told Ryles with their actions they want to stay here.