The Cumberland Throw

Roster Ruminations – Parra Player Predictions

What will the Parramatta 2019 roster look like? Will it be different enough or strong enough to drive the Eels from cellar dwellers to top 8 contenders?

The next few months should clarify which players have been retained, who’s been released and the names of the younger players elevated into the top squad. We can be patient and wait for the announcements or team list profiles to appear on the official website, but where’s the fun in that?

Therefore, I’m going to throw my hat into the ring to examine the decisions around the 35 player roster for next season. Because most NRL squads like to keep a roster spot up their sleeve for a mid season signing, I’m not going to list a 36th player. Please note that I’m including the possible rookie contract players in this list, given that the NRL is considering a change to the NRL eligibility of these players.

But here’s the problem. There will be 38 players named below, and I’m suggesting that up to six more names could be added. It doesn’t add up.

Newly Contracted (7 roster positions)

Paulo, Lane, Ferguson, Sivo
I have no names (though there are rumours on social media), but I’m tipping a further three potential signings. I’d suggest this could be two forwards and a back.

update – Andrew Davey reportedly added – back rower Townsville Blackhawks

Elevated Players including rookies (9 – 15 roster positions)

My Definites – Kaufusi, Mahoney, Salmon, Stone, D. Brown, Utoikamanu, Dunster, Fainga’a, Parry

My Possibles – Afualo, Dresler, Schneider + up to 3 others

Contracted NRL players (17 players)

Alvaro, N. Brown, Evans, French, Gutherson, Hoffman, M. Jennings, Leleisiuao , Mannah, Ma’u, Moeroa, Moses, Niukore, Norman, Smith, Takairangi, Terepo

Likely to Extend But Unconfirmed (4 players)

Gower, Hayne, G. Jennings, Pritchard

Unknown

D. Aukafolau (2017 Rookie)

Gowie is a fine mentor for younger players.

I’m very confident that Gower, Hayne, Jennings and Pritchard will have a deal sorted or announced in the near future. There are also some question marks surrounding the final number of elevated players. I think we can lock in somewhere between 9 and 15 players, but this will be dependent on what happens with the contracted players.

I have not listed any player still without a contract for 2019 – they might be negotiating an extension, but there has been little mail suggesting this to be likely.

Given my confidence that at least 9 young players will be elevated into the top squad, I’d suggest that a minimum of six names will disappear from the lists above. Even if I remove the three rookie contract possibles along with Aukafolau, it still leaves the likelihood that two contracted players might be released.

I’ve gone on record with my belief that the Eels cannot enter the 2019 season with both Moses and Norman in the halves. That could be a likely roster change.

The question then remains whether they consider the size of the contract, the depth in the position, or the quality of the individual when deciding on other potential releases. If the club chases a marquee signing, this could impact the decision to either free up cap space or shed excess players in a position.

Looking at the roster from another perspective might help with finalising the squad. Accordingly, here’s a depth chart to shed light on the strengths and weaknesses of positions.

Forwards
Middle – Paulo, Utoikamanu, Alvaro, N .Brown, Mannah, Terepo, Evans, Gower, Dresler (possible rookie) plus likely signing
Middle/Edge – Lane, Kaufusi, Moeroa
Edge – Ma’u, Niukore, Takairangi, Stone, Fainga’a, plus likely signing
Dummy Half – Mahoney, Pritchard, Schneider (possible rookie)

Backs
Back 3 – Hayne, Ferguson, French, G. Jennings, Hoffman, Sivo, Leleisiuao, Parry, Dunster (Aukafolau?)
Centres – Gutherson, M. Jennings, Afualo (possible rookie) plus likely signing
Halves – Moses, Norman, Salmon, Smith, D. Brown

 

Who backs up Mahoney?

Analysing possible roster changes from this perspective, it looks as if the Eels are short on specialist centres (though some back three players are possible selections) and dummy halves. They could recruit in these areas.

Conversely, Parra seem to have the back three positions well covered and might look to clear roster space there. Rumours that French is on the move have circulated on social media and Hoffman is approaching the end of his career. Perhaps one of these two might not be with the Eels in 2019.

In a market which has been relatively scant in free-agent players, the Eels have picked up some decent signings. However, they should not be finished with their roster just yet. I’ve tipped three more players will be added but another impact forward must be a priority. If none become available then we need to blood Utoikamanu early in the season.

How patient are you feeling Eels fans? Are you champing at the bit to hear more signing news? The NRL finals will rightly be the focus of attention over the next three weeks, but out in the golden west, I can’t help but feel that interesting if not challenging decisions are being made.

I suspect all will be known before November 1. Incredibly, that’s not that far away!

 

Eels forever!

 

Sixties

 

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119 thoughts on “Roster Ruminations – Parra Player Predictions

  1. John Eel

    Sixties you have included Afualo as a possible centre but not D Aukafolau, I find that interesting. However I have always thought that he may be destined to be an edge forward.

    Middles in my opinion would be definitely light on especially given that Vave is no longer wanted. My view is that they have something in mind to let Vave go. I would like to see Utoikamanu get some time in NRL next year but to rely on him for big periods is a concern.

    Whilst this may seem contradictory to what I said above I am surprised that you think that Gowie will get another year. He has been a great servant to the club since BA signed him in 2014 but for me he is holding back a position that could go to one of the young players.

    The other obvious concern is for number 9’s. Based on that I would suggest we are desperately short. I don’t know what the answer is but a seasoned player more than a star recruit is required to add further backup to Reed. Looking above if Reed goes down we would be desperate.

    1. sixties Post author

      Good point John. I believe that dummy half needs strengthening or at least depth added.
      Given the young players being added, Gowie will play an important mentoring role. He is an important depth signing at the least.
      I hadn’t included Dane in the depth chart because I just don’t know what his status is going forward, and he was on a rookie contract. I’ve now bracketed him in the post.
      As Hamish said, he switched to back row late in the season in ISP – and made a decent go of it too.

  2. John Eel

    Two more points Sixties. Firstly Tony Williams. early indications were that he may get an extension, is this still on the cards. Also I thought that Hoffman was off contract for 2019. Obviously not true.

        1. sixties Post author

          Silly man, even the club was toying with any thoughts about throwing him another contract, he’s finished that, and he’s impacted his prospects for elsewhere.

          1. Colin Hussey

            The sorrow of this is not just the impact it will have on his career as he is likely to around 1% chance of getting another contract somewhere, but he will have to serve out the suspension before being able to play, but my thoughts go to his family…

  3. Colin Hussey

    Thought provoking post Sixties.

    I wonder re Gower staying but in saying that he is a player who would not let the side down, age is wearying him a little I think.

    From my perspective looking through the names, I’m afraid that if some contracted players are to be let go, its a tossed coin between Norms and Moses, Moses has shown signs of Sandow this year with his showings and wanting things his way as against the team concept, Norms, has been very inconsistent as well, but if he went would mean the eels would have to outlay more money, over MM if he was to get a stint elsewhere.

    I certainly do not believe that Smith has shown any value this year, and would be happy to see him let go, again another player who was given a 2 year deal starting in 2019 and should not have been re-signed as early as he was.
    Looking also at Hoffman, who is another player under contract for 2019, while he’s had injury problems, I would suggest that he could be a candidate to be moved on. Thing is I guess how many contracted players will go? If I was to choose between say Hoff and French, I think I would have French as the keeper, as he has youth on his side, still an excitement machine and with a new season in front of him and a decent mentor could mean if he recaptures his form of the previous two seasons, then he is a needed keep.

    I notice TRex is not mentioned although there was some talk about giving him another year following his form in the few matches he played in.

    One other area that is an unknown for next year is the coaches, and I am not looking at BA in this aspect but moreso who will coach ISP. Looking at results there and with Nathan Cayless having been in charge for 2 years now and Wenty being very much hot and cold, I tend to believe a refresh is needed there for 2019. While Nathan has been a good club man for the eels, as a coach I think he is a bit lacking.

    1. sixties Post author

      I believe that decisions about staff will be made within the next week or two, based on review findings.
      Smith has certainly had injury issues, and he’s one of those players who will possibly never own a position but rather have utility value.
      It’s hard to argue with your logic when it comes to choices between players, though salaries may be a factor.

      1. Colin Hussey

        I think a problem we have is that as you said Smith has utility value more than being able to own a spot. There has been a lot of attacks put on Pritchard in different areas, also with French owing to his size, that also applies a bit for Pritchard, but if one was to look at Smith, he is small, and actually smaller than French.

        Both of them are listed in the eels gallery page as being fullbacks, that being the case, Smith is at a disadvantage in that area, also when he came in as a hooker he is then smaller than Pritchard, and even Mahoney. While that is no fault of him it certainly places him at a disadvantage, add he is older than the others is another factor as well.

        My thoughts would have Mahoney as a utility option, & if Pritchard is offered another contract then he be the run on 9, with Mahoney the back up 9 but also utility aspect as well, a better option I think than Smith. The worst part is with the salary aspect you mention as a factor, Smith has 2 years on a new deal starting in 2019,

        1. sixties Post author

          Colin, through no fault of his own, Pritchard has had a horror run with injuries. We can never go into a season planning on him to play the season. Admire his loyalty and tenacity.

        1. John Eel

          I thought he was signed to 2020. I will defer to your broader knowledge on the matter. I have already got Hoffman wrong

  4. Blue n Gold Fanatic

    All ways a great read.
    Can you confirm.
    I am hearing Dressler maybe out due to his knee and requires more surgery.
    Not great for the kid if true. That would be 3rd Acl in 3 years if correct..!

    1. sixties Post author

      We watched Steve in the Flegg elimination final just over a week ago. His knees have been an issue but I can’t comment on him having another operation – I hope not!

  5. Jeronimo

    Steve Dresler had huge wraps on him two years back but seems to have been surpassed by Kaufasi and Utoik in the talent talk. Does he have any distinguishing features over the two aforementioned?

    Also, what happened to Faainga? He was near unstoppable last year but a year older and hardly rated a mention all year. I know he was injured but does anyone seriously see him challenging for a first grade spot over a Matata or Tepai?

    1. sixties Post author

      Steve has battled against injury to return during this season – as Stefano has also previously. To me, Steve is an old fashioned forward – plays with great aggression and skill.
      Fainga’a has missed a bit of footy this year but was elevated to ISP. The club rates him and he’s been doing some extra training with NRL staff.

      1. Offside

        Lots of injury history might stop Steve from fufilling that early promise especially if the rumour of another surgery is true would be a shame

  6. The rev aka Snedden.

    Sixties rumour doing the rounds is that Liam knight has had a meeting with BA last week. Also rumours that you might know of is kapow coming to eels.

    From what I’ve read on social media is that his already a done deal just waiting on manly to give him the release.

    The same with David glammer his not happy with the pay that the bulldogs are paying him n looking to get out of that contract.

    Not sure on any backs apart from siko n ferguson. Maybe feki to play wing.

    On reignings I hope we lock up gennings his been real good for us.

    1. sixties Post author

      Rev, I’ve looked at predicting the number of signings rather than the names. Yes, I’ve heard the same rumours. George is keen to stay and the club have been happy with his season.

  7. Anonymous

    Instead of making assumptions maybe have some communication with the club. To often on this site i read articles and biased opinions. I am all for an opinion, But i like to be informed on facts. I can inform you some information is right, But other information is incorrect. We all have favorite players at the club but all information should be transparent where we can all make informed decisions on factual evidence as opposed to hearsay or your personal opinion.
    No matter what people think the club has plans for certain players whether individuals like others players in the same position or not.

    We all judge players on field based performance

    The club bases players on field base performance.
    Work ethic
    Leadership qualities
    Development based on positions
    Coachability
    Training ethic
    Personality

    If we were all asked to put in order top 5 young players coming through the club.
    I am confident what we all write will be completely different to what the coaching staff and recruitment write.
    The coaching staff and the employees of the club deal with the players very regularly and see things we are not privy to on a daily basis.

    1. Milo

      Ok, thank you for this. So articles based on biased views?
      That’s your view bud; i find it more accurate and less biased with rubbish than another parra site; but each to their own.

    2. Colin Hussey

      Anon, everyone has opinions and at this stage of things its all pretty well speculation, unless of course what some are saying have associations with the club and privy to behind the scenes information.

      The only people that have an idea about who will be signed and who goes are those actually involved in the clubs workings, and at this stage that would be the coach who would have a list of those he wants to stay and who to go, likely also those involved in the player development as well, along with the finances of the club and the like. The content of the review will also have a fair bearing and until even they know what is in it and the recommendations, its all opinions.

      1. sixties Post author

        Thanks Colin. The classification and title of this post make it clear that I’m speculating but trying to break down the reasoning behind my predictions.

    3. sixties Post author

      Firstly Anon, thanks for your detailed response. The club won’t go through such decisions with a supporter site if they are in the process of informing players or negotiating contracts. This is listed as an opinion piece as that’s exactly what it is Anon.
      As for judging players I touched on it without going into the details you have. See here: “The question then remains whether they consider the size of the contract, the depth in the position, or the quality of the individual when deciding on other potential releases. ” The quality of the individual referred to on field and off field. I reckon your characteristics listed is almost worth a post in itself, but I’m aware that lots goes into assessment.
      Overall, thanks for your feedback, but we are simply providing an opinion on a topic that we can’t really give official comments on.

    4. Trouser Eel

      Please remove this dribble comment from Anonymous. The article indicates it is speculation right from the get-go. If someone isn’t interested in reading an opinion piece, they just need to move on.

    5. Anonymous

      Dont read it then mate , actually this site is pretty damm acurate and informed unlike others, anyway as i said if you dont like it dont read it .are you trying to convince us or yourself your a footy guru.

    6. Anonymous

      Of course you are right, Sixties needed to make an appointment with the big guns(Gurr, Arthur) and ask them who they were promoting and who they would let go. Silly Sixties not thinking of that!

  8. Milo

    Interesting discussion Sixties; and i too hoped Trex may be getting a year extension but maybe we have someone else to come in?
    I think we need the dummy half situation as in one more depth and halves sorted asap, or BA and team will be in for a tough season beginning with a lot of added pressure.
    With some of those young kids we need a couple of hard heads in the run on team, and maybe one or two of them are new signings.
    No news from here in the UK mate, except politics and The Sun Pg 3 lasses.

    1. John Eel

      Milo I like your point about the hard heads. Club needs experience and hard heads. All the teams in the top 8 have that. Can’t get there with a team of kids

      1. John Eel

        Colin may also depend on how he recovers from his second ACL operation. It is going to take a lot of hard work on T Rex’s part. Will depend on his commitment and desire.

    2. sixties Post author

      I agree about hard heads – I’ll call them mentors.
      I know you are only aware of page 3 lasses. A married bloke like you wouldn’t be a student of the page!

  9. Pete

    Hooker and second prop are definites. The halves is the tricky part. Moses and Norman have been disappointing that goes without saying. Rather than moving them on and contributing to their salaries I would bring in a halves coach to sort it out and bring Salmon and Edwards up to speed. I still think that Norman and Moses can work well together but something needs to be done come 1st Nov.

    1. Trouser Eel

      Pete, you’ve summed up perfectly my feelings. I think there must be something behind the hot & cold performances of our 6 & 7. Some specialist coaching, and consistent service from a 9 could be all we need. Some big boggers to get some protection and movement should deal the deal.

    2. Longfin Eel

      It actually seems this year that Moses and Norman were not given clear direction of what their roles were. They are both talented players and have shown in the past that they can play together, but they need to commit to what their role is. I agree also that some specialist halves training is imperative – at least to sort their roles out.

      1. sixties Post author

        A couple of years back, BA brought in Noddy Kimmorley for a couple of sessions, but it didn’t end up long term. I think with regard to Moses and Norman the key word is “commit”. These blokes are meant to lead the team around the field. They need to be on the same page.

  10. Fletch

    Just throwing this out there…
    As Gutherson’s preferred position would be considered as FB, but it looks like he’ll have to play Centre given our roster, would it be worth considering if he could give Dummy Half a crack? This may bolster a lacking position. He needs to get his hands on the ball more. He is an effective playmaker and runner, if not entirely a halves player. As Hooker he would touch the ball more than anyone, could he add an extra dimension as a running Dummy Half? I guess the question would be could he handle the physicality of the position?
    Thoughts?
    Tear away but please be polite ;0)

    1. Hamsammich

      I suspect that Mahoney will be the starting dummy half and we’ll look to play him 80 minutes most weeks. Gutherson is then too good to only play 20 or so minutes as a utility.

      1. Fletch

        Oh I agree he needs more game time than a typical utility, just throwing it out there as a way to add depth. Cash should be our #1 Dummy Half but I think, with the right prep, Guth could fill in there effectively if needed. Injuries have bitten us on the ass too much this year to be able to rely on one person for a position.

    2. sixties Post author

      Always polite Fletch! I like what Gutho does when he jumps in to dummy half for a run. I reckon the occasional run is his go, but I can see why you’d think he could cause problems from 9.

  11. Pete

    Thanks Sixties, very keen interest in 2019 by all I am certain. Thanks for filling us in on the up and comers. I’m really positive about the Young guns coming through. I agree with your assessment of signings needed. Although, I really can’t see our 2018 lack of points scored changing much with the halves we have. If we don’t get any signings/movement in the halves I would look at; 1 Hayne 7 Norman 6 Salmon 9 Mahoney and use Moses off the bench for spark. I would train this substituting with Norman/Moses and make sure we have 3 or 4 trial games this year. Based on the trial games as to who gets starting No 7. That should make it competitive.
    Thanks

    1. sixties Post author

      Thanks Pete. If you told me to jump off the fence and make a call I’d go Brown and Norman with Salmon to the bench to work on a utility role.

  12. Jimmy Corbo

    Your TCT Foreign Correspondent (self appointed) can confirm Gowie has one more year. He is staying at the same hotel as me in Disneyland and I ran into him this morning.

    He is a real Gentleman and you really hope he does stay at the club in some capacity post his footy career.

    I didn’t ask about any other players, he was very generous with his time and was kind enough to wish my kids a great day at Disney so I thought thought it best to leave it at that rather than compromising him by asking questions on rumours or matters concerning other players.

    1. Colin Hussey

      While I am happy that Gowie is going to stay, and yes I believe he could add to the club after he finished playing, much like Steve Edge did with the general aspects of the club,

      This brings me to the retirement of Beau Scott, I am not, and was not overtly happy with the appointment of David Kidwell to the defence coaching role, and while he was hard in his playing days, I can’t say he’s been a great success in an assistant coaching role elsewhere.

      If we wanted a defensive coach, then I would suggest the Scott could add more to the team than Kidwell could. Scott could well be the person who could add the aspect of mongrel and hard hitter coach to the squad going forward.

        1. sixties Post author

          Correct Offside. I spoke to Beau a couple of weeks ago and asked if he was looking to get involved in coaching or any other club roles. He said he’s flat out with his business, and he seemed quite enthused in talking about it too.

  13. Clive

    Nice write up mate and it certainly throws up plenty of food for thought.

    Obviously our halves and front row have been a major issue this year and at least we have added Junior to the squad but someone like Taupau would be a huge signing.

    In my opinion Norman needs to be the one moved on. At his age he should be at the top of his game and yet he is still a very inconsistent performer. The issue with that is I think Moses needs an experienced game manager as his halves partner to help him take his game to the next level and that takes us back to the drawing board. Who is available that fits that role?? I really can’t see a Moses/Salmon partnership delivering in the next two years.

    I think one of BA’s major mistakes this season was he was too loyal to guys that were not performing and I believe he needs to get ruthless with some of his old favourites. As a result guys like Takarangi and Manu Ma’u need to be let go. I know Manu will raise eyebrows but he’s just not damaging enough to warrant an automatic selection.

    The other issue is a football manager. Why on earth Bernie decided to take this role on is beyond me. We need someone who is old enough not to be seen as a threat to BA and with enough footy nous to make the key decisions and for Brad to use as a sounding board. I think guys like Wayne Bennett, Brian Smith and Tim Sheens would be a great place to start.

    1. sixties Post author

      I agree with you about loyalty Clive and put that down as a factor in my season review. We should here about a football manager in the very near future.

  14. Big Derek

    At the end of the day the suggested roster definitely lacks the hard edge and size that is needed to compete with the top 4 or top 6.

    As everyone has suggested there is a compelling need for another big middle forward and an experienced 9.

    Bernie continues to say that there is no one avaiable, as the self appointed head of everything that is not good enough. The spotlight is firmly on the CEO after a lacklustre period under his leadership, he needs to deliver something other than carefully worded statements. That even goes to the coverage of the Stadium, where the Eels fans are getting the best views off the soccer guys, that is poor leadership.

    The halves choice is stark, when Moses was injured, we had a decent run under Corey, but in reality the coaches should be able to deliver a decent outcome playing both of these talented halves.

    Little was mentioned of the coaching staff , and change is a necessity, new voices and different on field structures are paramount to success. The review and its implementation under the current board is crucial for the club to move into a new and desired era for a club with its support and profile

    1. Colin Hussey

      BD, what 9’s are available? Ok, there is Segeyaro, Luke and Koroisau, perhaps a couple of others that really are no better than we have.

      Realistically both Segeyaro and Luke are similar types of players, different ages though, with Sege hot and cold, some spark at times but if he is good, how come he’s still off contract with Sharks? Luke has more brain snaps than we have seen with a couple of other players, his performance against Penrith last week was terrible, besides that he wants to stay over the ditch, which is good for me.

      Koroisau, is perhaps the pick of the three, but in looking at him we have a player smaller than Reed Mahoney and Kaysa, but a bit more battle hardened though, but, why has Manly not taken steps to sign him?

      The key to the 9 spot really is in the other forwards able to take most of the load and be there to support the 9 but the 9 has to be there in support of the others, but in a different way. For the experience that Reed has shown I would not be bringing in others as he should build on this years games and go forward. Others including Gutho can take the dummy half role at times, and also if he gets an extension Kaysa can still be a fair backup.

      Certainly at least one more strong hard headed forward is needed, and as I said above, I would like to see some changes in the assistant coaching staff.

      1. Big Derek

        My issue with the 9, is that Kaysa seems not to be the answer to working alongside our hookers that are still learning and have great promise. I would be looking for someone like sayMitch Rein, experienced and capable. Hard to think that apart from enthusiasm what Kaysa offers , his service has been below par andMahoney offers much more around the play the ball.
        Others will possibly disagree, but that’s how I see the situation currently, we need someone there who is not at the club to assist .

      2. sixties Post author

        The problem for Kaysa is that his injuries have left him relatively inexperienced. His 47 NRL games are on track for a 24 year old, but Kaysa debuted in 2013, which means he’s averaged less than 8 games per year. Courageous, skillful, fast, inspirational, incredible work ethic – but still learning how to read a game and pace himself. Do we need a more experienced dummy half to back up Mahoney – that’s an important decision.

        1. Colin Hussey

          I believe he deserves another year, and would love to see him go through a season injury free. The stats on him show he’s had a terrible run with injuries, what I believe he needs is some quality strengthening and conditioning by a real sports coach, how many trainers has the eels had in his time since 2013, we also easily forget how Peats was also problematic with injuries and still much the same with the GC, would sincerely love to see him have a full season without an injury, it is a confidence thing for him and if injury free we could see a different player altogether.

          BD, I don’t think I was suggesting that Kaysa work along side Reed as such, he is not someone who would be in any sort of mentoring arena either. I also have said for ages now that we need someone brought in that has been a good 9 and can help both of them. Early on I suggested Farah, but was put down there, then I mentioned Ennis, who could be a huge benefit to the both of them. There is no real reason why the two of them could form a fair combo going forward.

    2. sixties Post author

      As you and I have discussed Derek, I’m being patient in waiting for the review recommendations. Given the external people involved and their track record, I’ll put faith in their recommendations.

      1. Anonymous

        Fair enough Sixties, but a club like the Eels need some strong almost vociferous leader as CEO given the fall from grace of the NRL coach recently and the admin .
        Let’s hope he is working the phones etc to bring that crucial front rower we need. Have to be convinced that Bernies demeanour is not one that would see him as aggressive trying to get difficult deals over the line.
        Let’s see how that works out, yet to be convinced that someone who had the financial clout and influence that Uncle Nick provided behind him previously will work for us.

        Happy to be proved entirely wrong.

  15. BDon

    Tks sixties for hoisting us up into the helicopter. Like most others, I cant quite spot the holy grail just yet. The spine has to be resolved. The top teams have their key playmakers hard wired into the team structure, the Storm have been a bit disrupted but Slater, Munster and Smith can probably carry a rookie 7. Penrith losing Wallace has jolted their spine.
    I like Mahoney’s potential, his game will grow as confidence grows. I noticed he got traffic his way already so his durability will be tested.
    If by some off season magic Michael Jennings could rediscover his mojo, we look well served 1-5. Need more grunt in the forwards to set things up better for playmakers.

    1. Colin Hussey

      I totally agree with you BDon re MJ, he needs a big year, if for no other reason than redeeming himself, we know how he can play, but he’s slipped down the ladder a fair bit, so he needs to start his climb again without getting stuck on a low rung again.

    2. sixties Post author

      BDon and Colin, I totally agree about Jennings. He had a very poor season. I will be monitoring how Ethan Parry performs in ISP next year. He can cover wing, centre and fullback.

  16. Shelley

    The eventual squad will be interesting to say the least. I know one thing, if the Norman- Moses situation, conflict or combination is not fixed or mended however that may be, not much will change. I don’t really know the solution because in truth I don’t really know what the problem was but it must be addressed with honesty and quickly.

    I also don’t know enough about the young kids to say if we have enough depth in front row and outside backs, particularly centre. I always have to laugh when supporters from all teams act like fixing list problems is both quick and easy. Conversations like, we need a prop and Klemmer is good, go get him are heard too often. People tend to ignore the fact that if a player is under contract the other team can say no or demand a swap with a player from our club who also must agree. Could you imagine a team said we need a player like Brown, Parra you must release him. But some Parra fans expect other clubs to give us what we want, at the price we want, without us giving in return a player of quality they need. It is amusing and silly season is only just beginning.

    Like many observing from the outside I think we probably could do with one more 9, a front rower and centre. However I only want a top quality one and if they are not available I would rather give our young players the chance to develop, accepting that there will be some good and bad games as they adjust to first grade. I expect our senior players and leaders, like Jennings, Gutho, Mannah, Brown, Norman ( if at Parra still) Hayne and Mau to step up in the off season, train hard , be really fit come game 1 , be disciplined and dedicated every training session and show the way for these young players who will be doing a full pre season for the first time- nothing less can be accepted from our senior players. Ultimately I would rather develop our young ones over taking players from other clubs who are not good enough for other clubs respective top 30 list.

    1. sixties Post author

      Nailed a couple of important factors there Shelley.
      Firstly, free agents. You can’t just approach a player who’s not a free agent. I realise players leave contracts but it is more complicated at that point. Ideally you’d like another big prop but finding one is another matter.
      Secondly, our senior/elite players must step up to be mentors for the younger players. It’s that simple.

  17. Metal Stud

    Hi Sixties, long time reader first timer writer….

    As many have said here I think our concern areas are front row and hooker. I think our edges, back 3 and centres have the depth we can work with. Halves are a problem but I think will stay and need to pull their fingers out fast and do need a hard head halves coach to help.

    Front Row/ Middle: With Brown, Gower, Moeroa and Stone(and a few others) covering the lock forward position its our genuine front row that concerns me. At this stage I see 5 first grade standard front rowers in the squad – Paulo, Mannah, Alvaro, Terepo, Evans. You could argue that the last 2/3 on that list are fringe first graders at best. This rotation just won’t cut it to go deep into the finals. Its no secret that we need another strike prop to do what we have been after for years but unfortunately there are none left on the market. Hence the talk of Klemmer or Tapau breaking contract. Both I would take at a pinch and we will have to leave that up to the guys behind the scenes to work through…fingers crossed. For our depth props we have a few coming through that you mentioned but none tested as yet so I see another two purchases needed here to fill the job Matagi and Vave did….but better. Zane Tetavano is avaialble, aggressive and hard edged. Also the Roosters could do with cap space. Do you know if we are looking at him? The other is Max King from the Titans, a big body and aggressive. Unsigned for next year who might compliment our pack well. Other than that any other off contract props are either at retirement age (and retirement form) or have had their chances at other clubs and failed. We missed Ah Mau, Boyd, Sims, Glasby and Grant. The pickings are slim unless we look to England.

    Hooker: I think we have tried for too long to promote a hooker from within or bargain buys. Pritchard and King are handy back ups but will not take us into the finals let alone a premiership. Mahoney again has talent but is small and needs a few seasons to come along. In my opinion we must buy a strike hooker. Luke, Korisau and Seggy are all on the market and we must strike on one of these.

    With an intimidating front row, a gun hooker to take advantage we have the edges and the backline to capitalise and watch our halves improve out of sight if these two areas are fixed.

    Cheers
    Metal Stud

      1. Metal Stud

        Shaun Lane is a great ‘option’ for the middle and would do well there……however he is still young and relatively mobile and think he can be at his most dangerous for us on the right edge running at halves, creating offloads and god willing scoring tries.

        Again it’s ‘genuine’ front row we are lacking.

        1. Colin Hussey

          Is there any benefit at looking at young players from other clubs, especially 21 year old props and forwards at the expense of some of those in our back yard?

          1. sixties Post author

            Colin, the backyard has good young props. I wouldn’t like the message from recruiting similar aged players from elsewhere. We can justify purchasing experienced players that improve the squad, but we have the right kids in my opinion.

          2. Anonymous

            Thanks sixties, that is what I believe as well, for many of us its a no win situation with many wanting to bring this player in and that player, each in the late teens/early 20’s if that fails, or one of our jnrs heads outside they complain about that especially if that player does well.

            While I am unable to get down to games or training these days, I do try to read NSWRL match reviews both of ISP, Flegg and others, some with video clips gives some idea of the quality players we have, also reports on here by yourself and others in how these players are being kept at the club rather than heading elsewhere, but not all can be kept.

          3. Anonymous

            Think this is why weve lost good young up and comers in the past by blocking pathways then someone else offers them a door so naturally they take it , last couple of seasons it seems to me ba has been trying to escalate the junior pathways in an effort to find and promote our best before others steal them , taken couple of seasons to bring it about but end 2018 plus 2019 it looks like hes getting there, mahoney ,salmon , stone , kafusi , next brown ,parry ,stefano and others , getting back to our roots !!

    1. sixties Post author

      Superb first up comment metal stud. You can’t argue with the logic about the benefit of a quality dummy half and impact props when it comes to the performance of the halves. I still see Norman and Moses as oil and water, but if they must play, then providing a better platform gives them every opportunity.
      Ideally we need that extra big body – if we can’t then the measured introduction of Utoikamanu is crucial.
      Keep the opinions coming Metal Stud. Great debut!

      1. Metal Stud

        Thanks Sixties happy to contribute. I have looked at the off contract first grade props around the grounds and have come up with this list. I have not included retirees;

        * Tevita Pangai Jnr, Sam Tagatese (Broncos) Will struggle to lure TPJ away from Wayne
        * Max King, Paterika Vaivai (Titans)
        * Kelepi Tanginoa (Sea Eagles)
        * Tui Kamikamica, Pat Kafusi (Storm)
        * Josh King (Knights)
        * Scott Bolton,Sam Hoare, (Cowboys)
        * Hame Sele (Dragons)
        * Zane Tetavano, Eloni Vunakece, Lindsay Collins (Roosters)
        * Ligi Sao (Warriors)

        On closer inspection M King, Kamikamica, Tetavano and Sao could help bolster our pack. Bolton would add experience but I doubt he would come south.

        Looking at the Hookers there are Luke, Korisau, Segeyaro, Rein and Baptise all off contract. I’ve not seen a year where that many quality hookers are available. Me thinks any of these could help our ruck speed and service, not to mention leadership.

        Thoughts on any of the above off contract?

        Metal Stud

        1. DDay

          MS – good post. As Shelley has suggested “free agents” really limits the gene pool. Taking your point that Alvaro sets the minimum standard (love Alvaro’s contribution, any addition needs to be a genuine bend the line type Prop like Junior that adds some size to the pack).
          Daniel Alvaro – 25 years old, 108kg, 190cm, ave 105m / game, 68 NRL Games
          Junior Paulo – 24 years old, 123kg, 188cm, ave 101m / game, 108 NRL Games
          Max King 21 years old, 105kg, 188cm, ave 80m/game,12 NRL Games
          Kamikamica – 24 years old, 110kg, 190cm, ave 47m / game, 5 NRL Games
          Tetavano – 27 years old, 111kg, 189cm, ave 98m / game, 77 NRL Games
          Ligi Sao – 25 years old, 107kg, 189cm, ave 39m / game, 75 NRL Games
          The four closer inspection names don’t measure up with Alvaro (solely based on NRL stats) so become development acquisitions…we already have Kane Evans in that category. So it’s to be hoped Bernie can use his experience & influence and land a contracted player like Taupau.
          Or maybe Tony Williams become a viable option – 29 years old, 118kg, 193cm, ave 81m / game, 170 NRL Games?

          1. Colin Hussey

            IIRC Kamikamica played for the eels a few years back then went to Rah Rah then to the Storm, big player but did not show out that much really,

            Pola has developed more the last couple of years and I thought was worth more than just the one year extension, but he will be in the top 17 next year unless he losses form.

          2. Metal Stud

            Polar is def in our top 3 Props but Paulo, Mannah and him need some intimidating, robust hombres to go with him. He is great when he fires up. He is our worker prop along with Mannah.

            Guys like Tetavano and Kamikamica have been in winning systems. I like that. What can they bring to the competitive nature and professionalism at the Eels?

          3. Metal Stud

            Thanks DDay,

            Keep in mind Alvaro is a starter at the Eels….would he be at these other clubs? Hence why his stats are up. I do see your point and I have mentioned these names as what is ‘available’ as the best of a bad bunch and are options to fill our rotation, provide competition to our front line props and provide adequate cover during injuries.

            TRex is interesting and has the size. I thought he played well before injury. Does he have the motor for the middle? Does he have the mindset? Can he recover from another leg injury? More questions than an archeologist for TRex.

            If we look at other top six clubs and their top front row options it’s stark contrast to us.

            Storm: Bromwich x 2, Asofa Solomona, Kasiano, Glasby, Welch
            Roosters: Hargreaves, Napa, Liu, Taukeiaho, Tetavano, FPN,
            Panthers: RCG, Tamou, Merrin, McKendry, Fisher Harris, Leota
            Sharks: Fifita, Prior, Woods, Seumanufagai, Gallen
            Dragons: Vaughan, Graham, Ah Mau, Latimore, Sims coming
            Rabbits: Burgess x 3, (enough said)

            These are mostly rep quality props and with depth. we are just nowhere near that unfortunately and need some help upfront to support Paulo. Our halves and backs will continue to get slaughtered if nothing changes.

            May the footy Gods be with us

            MS

          4. sixties Post author

            Quality response again MS, especially your depth chart across teams. Danny is an interesting player. He’s like an old fashioned prop – he keeps getting better with age and finds an aspect of his game to improve every year. Expect him to be a bit heavier next year and more aggressive.

          5. DDay

            MS you are right, we are a looong way behind those front row rosters with ~6 top line middle forwards. Probably need 2 extra rep quality middle forwards + local rookies…
            Maybe another angle is explore the English Super League for a James Graham type but no Lee Mossops

          6. BDon

            If you do the same across club comparison with 1,6,7,9 you end up in the same place.We’ve got some work to do, but you can’t help but think a focussed approach to more skill, size and aggression in the forwards will solve many ills.
            Heargraves would run over his grandmother, Reed Mahoney already has an inkling of this.

        2. sixties Post author

          Thanks MS. I’ve suggested that Parra will add a couple of forwards before pre-season – or am I hoping for that? I would look at King or Tetavano. Kamikamica has been with the Eels and I’m not sure he would add any more than young Eels like Kaufusi or Utoikamanu. Just quietly, Stefano’s older brother, Filia, could be interesting to watch if he gets on the field next year. He was injured playing 18s Origin in 2017, and is a promising forward.
          I’d rate Rein the best of the off contract 9s. No problem from me if we recruited him.

    2. MattL

      I agree that we really need a Klemmer or Tapau type prop added.
      Not only because our props are a little light on aggression, but because their go forward would really unleash & regain the best of Nathan Brown on the 2nd or 3rd hit up.

      1. sixties Post author

        It seems that most responders are in agreement about securing another impact prop. The big question is availability. If none are on the market, then I believe we take that punt on Utoikamanu next year.

        1. MattL

          That seems to be the positive new outlook. Less squad players being brought in. Only buy proven quality players or promising young guns & if none are available, promote juniors. Worst case scenario, if any of the above don’t shine they become squad players.

    1. sixties Post author

      I believe he’s a genuine option purchase. Of course, if a bloke hasn’t played first grade yet, there’s always the unknown. His contract probably reflects that.

  18. Colin Hussey

    A couple of thoughts on Norms and Moses along with Bev.

    With the review approaching completion, and reading in a media release that all the players have been interviewed by the review people along with other football staff, what would have a certainty in the questions would have been to do with the form of Norms and Moses, especially the constant reports of them not getting along, and the lack of combination, especially after season 2017 how they pretty well gelled, while it is unlikely that there would be any publication of any of the Q&A’s from both sides, how likely would it be that with the reasons out and say resolved would both be worth keeping? Its a hard call this early but given that both have their own unique abilities, and good enough for one to be well in contention for a medal in 2016 and the other for SOO rep position this year. Not forgetting that Norms also held the record for 40/20’s not long back and how many this year?

    Tells me that both have enough talent to be a force in their respective positions, that is of course if they want to be here and capable of playing together.

    Bev, another player that seriously went backwards this year, was it a dummy spit of toss away because he was not playing at the back, thing was that BA succumbed and chose him there, with no success what so ever, other words he blew his audition, but at the same time he was not alone there either.

    On reflection I believe that he was playing very much hurt, & I don’t mean injured, his previous years form had him a superstar and I don’t believe he took that on and had a puffed up ego, rather he was hurt in the way the whole team was playing, his mid season injury, in all likelihood also put more of a downer on his general demeanor along with loss of confidence as he then tried to get back into the top side. Playing beside and behind a very much defeated pack along with a couple of the backs not performing, I doubt he believed in himself being the player that he was, and with more experienced players around him not producing, it also affected his actual psyche in thinking he was and is not good enough, and the only way forward for him was to play somewhere else.

    I really doubt that going elsewhere will help him as going to a higher positioned club he may not get many turns in the top grade, if he went to a club in a worse position than the eels he would be no better and possibly worse than if he stayed.

    Thus the prospect of some stronger forwards, and other new players, with an overall team remake and playing winning football may well just be the medicine to lift him back to what we know he was and still is capable of.

    Now time to switch off and go to bed.

    1. sixties Post author

      Colin, if we are trying to offload any of them, they are still under contract and if there’s no takers or the players don’t want to leave, then we have to find ways to use them. As you suggest, a stronger pack may help, and perhaps the reality of being in the final year of a contract might push the go button for them.

      1. Anonymous

        I hope that if they all stay, they can lift to play as team members, especially Norms and MM, Bev, I think having his knee right and hopefully for Hayne to help him with the 1 spot along with inside players who do their job he will be fine.

        Players in the last year of a contract all need to use it as auditions for another contract, but once signed they need to also show the club and followers that they want to be here not just for the money, rather play to earn it.

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